Language Downloader suggestion - Printable Version
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Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-16-2004 at 04:02 PM
I have been discussing lately in one of those controverted translation threads about an unofficial language included in MP!. And that drove me to the idea of suggesting an interseting feature in Messenger Plus!:
The Language Downloader!
I've thought that if it's becoming a real memory problem to add those lots of languages it would be very useful to download them from the net.
Obviusly, all MP! users have Internet, so it shouldn't be considered a problem.
Even a dial-up connection wouldn't have many problems to download 30kB (or 5kB as Choli told me yesterday, hopefully compressed) they would download anyway once per language file included.
Well, the download of the selected language files (the actual language list should be retrieved at the beginning of the Setup) could be during the setup, before the sponsor agreement.
If there's no Internet connection (no language has/can bee/n selected), a message (in English) can suggest the user to download the language later, and remember it once signed in in Messenger:
"Remember you can choose another language NOW in the Plus! > Preferences > Language Panel".
Well, Choli himself found it useful, I don't know if Patchou will.
Another advantage is that we, translators, could upload anytime new versions or corrections to the server. MP! could ask once a week if the version on the server is newer than the installed!
I seriuosly duobt it could suppose a bandwidth overload...
That's all for now.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Leif on 01-16-2004 at 04:16 PM
A splendid suggestion! I second that!!
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Choli on 01-16-2004 at 04:48 PM
quote:Plus should include the files with the translation into all languages of the setup screens and maybe the main plus menu and a new entry called update language (or download new languages). During setup OR any other time, the user could be able to check if there are new translations avialable and download them. All the texts showed to do that should be in local language not (only) in english (that would be better, i mean).
Originally posted by KeyStorm
Well, the download of the selected language files (the actual language list should be retrieved at the beginning of the Setup) could be during the setup, before the sponsor agreement.
If there's no Internet connection (no language has/can bee/n selected), a message (in English) can suggest the user to download the language later, and remember it once signed in in Messenger:
That way, the user will be able to download any language that will be in the server (either when installing, or after that).
Doing this, we, translators, could update our files and ieach time plus checks for a new version of itself, it could check if there is a new version of the current language used.
quote:the best would be that we (only one or two traslators per language) have an account at the server where we could update the file whenever we want (and maybe also manage the emails of other translators in our language (bacause sometimes there are people who are in the email list and don't help in the translation)).
Originally posted by KeyStorm
we, translators, could upload anytime new versions or corrections to the server.
Btw, talking about languages... Why the language selection is global to all users? ie: I would like to have plus in spanish for one of my accounts and in english for the other. That will help me when I want to tell people how to do things.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by CookieRevised on 01-16-2004 at 05:02 PM
I agree...
But as always 
I have some points:
Everything that is suggested can be done already... Languages can be updated and posted as much as you/we want on the forums. IMHO the only advantage that the suggestion will bring, is that it will be centralised which is a very good thing by the way (now, you have to search in the forum for a language-update).
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Choli on 01-16-2004 at 05:29 PM
quote:think in user who don't understand english. for they the update system will be much easier that searching the forums.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
now, you have to search in the forum for a language-update
edit:
and also, the user won't have to worry about how to install the language because it'd be done automaticly by plus. (i know that doing it manually is easy, but I can assure you that there are a lot of people who don't know copy-paste files
)
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by CookieRevised on 01-16-2004 at 05:34 PM
agreed, that's also what I mean by centralisation. (otherwise what's the point in centralizing it...)
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-16-2004 at 06:08 PM
Well, Choli's idea isn't that bad 
. With the necessary strings in all languages, but then: which languages??
All? too much work for Patchou and for translators if they have to create two separate files... Well perhaps then with all national languages available we'd be done. (What would affect my own language *d'oh*, well Patchou will understand Catalan is necessary ¬_¬ ) Just kiddin'.
Well, let's see if Patchou finds it well, too.
And yes, centralisation would be comfortable for users and translators. NIce!
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Choli on 01-16-2004 at 06:15 PM
quote:that can be easily done using a simple program that splits the file (extracting one or two or the needed sections). I'd add that feature to my translator.
Originally posted by KeyStorm
which languages??
All? too much work for Patchou and for translators if they have to create two separate files...
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-16-2004 at 06:35 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
that can be easily done using a simple program that splits the file (extracting one or two or the needed sections). I'd add that feature to my translator.
Nice!
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-16-2004 at 06:57 PM
Listen:
If we are going to upload the files... With a PHP script we could actually edit the file that is online directly.
Hey guys I can some PHP and would be proud of helping the translators communuity
If Patchou accepts the idea, I could build it within this weekend!
All security issues... I don't know much about this... but the actual tool mustn't very hard to do... (If Choli could... 
).
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Guido on 01-16-2004 at 07:10 PM
Good idea, don't know if Patch would do it though 
Too much hassle... for something not many people will use
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-16-2004 at 07:39 PM
quote:Wait, every non-English-speaking user would use the feature and, I repeat I can do the tool. For security, doesn't the hosting provider give you the posibility to configure a directory as private and set several users and passwords to access it.
Originally posted by Guido
Good idea, don't know if Patch would do it though
Anyway we'll need an uploader, unless Patchou wants to constantly upload them manually.
But I think you're right...
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by CookieRevised on 01-16-2004 at 08:24 PM
Or there could be a extra page on these forums with all the languages listed with there version number/update date/and link to a thread where it is discussed.... all this maintained by 1 person, then the translators must upload/email/send/whatever their file to this person...
Kind of an extra thread, where that one person can delete post (for like example if a translator posts a language and the languagelist-maintainer can copy file into the toppost-list)
Blah... I don't explain it to well I guess, anyway...
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Choli on 01-16-2004 at 11:59 PM
quote:if you do it, remember it must support ansi and unicode formats for the Lang_*.ini files and also it sould support complex characters from complex languages like chinesse (and it you can do it (i wasn't able) it should support RTL languages)
Originally posted by KeyStorm
With a PHP script we could actually edit the file that is online directly.
Hey guys I can some PHP and would be proud of helping the translators communuity
If Patchou accepts the idea, I could build it within this weekend!
quote:I can do that. Should I post a thread in Translation with the details?
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Or there could be a extra page on these forums with all the languages listed with there version number/update date/and link to a thread where it is discussed.... all this maintained by 1 person, then the translators must upload/email/send/whatever their file to this person...
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 01-17-2004 at 12:09 AM
Sorry I came up so late, I wouldn't mind to help either.
And that thing... I don't know very much about all those formats, but I hope that, if HTML can, we can ! (Hopefully there are conversors on the net at least for PHP...). In that case perhaps, two weekends. 
Anyway, Cookie's idea seems more feasible...
Let's ask Patchou, if none did yet... which I doubt (all you Forum Masters)
But the idea with the private page isn't bad
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by frog on 04-21-2004 at 11:09 AM
sorry to bring up such an old thread
this should be a must in all future msgplus's cause it would shrink the download time and bandwidth emensly... if you get what i mean
and no-one uses every language file anyway, so i mean, this basically in my opinion is a must for all mp users.... and it would be excelent if it was emplemented in mp3.
also there are members willing to help out..... so it wont be too much of a hastle will it now?
bob
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 04-21-2004 at 12:53 PM
Yes yuo're right, its still a good idea
But the problem is that someone should have to do all that work. Probably MenthiX, the Translators-DB admin.
Programming the feature isn't very hard and has some sense (imo), so I'm happy this suggestion has been pushed up again 
What I thought, if Choli doesn't care and has some spare time, is to distribute among all translators a special version of his Translator app that would upload the new/corrected file directly to the server. In that case, for safety, each copy of the Translator should be personalized with the nick of the owner and add it as comment in any translator file created with it to detect leaks immediately (hope you got my point 
).
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Menthix on 04-21-2004 at 01:09 PM
I still need to make up my mind about how/what to update on the Translation DB, but i am very much intrested in your suggestions.
quote:Atually, i should already have that somewhere. The translation DB was written this way orriginally. But it was at the biginning of v2.0...
Originally posted by Choli
With a PHP script we could actually edit the file that is online directly.
Hey guys I can some PHP and would be proud of helping the translators communuity
- Everything was hosted on my own PC those days, the script was to complex to garantee it stable on my slow pc/low bandwith.
- I didn't want to delay 2.0 because of any possible problems.
- It needed more testing.
So we dropped the whole thing and only left the mailing script/admin panel. But i still have it, maybe it's worth trying/testing it again
.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 04-21-2004 at 01:28 PM
quote:
Originally posted by MenthiX
So we dropped the whole thing and only left the mailing script/admin panel. But i still have it, maybe it's worth trying/testing it again
There's sadly not much time left now, again
Well... we can test it to have it working it for further 3.x versions. That'd be great
.MenthiX remind Patch of this idea.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Menthix on 04-21-2004 at 01:40 PM
quote:True, i was planning on some minor changes but i skipped those too (another problem slowed things down).
Originally posted by KeyStorm
There's sadly not much time left now, again
But there will no doubt be other updates, i hope to see a major release of 4.0 once
. I think the best thing todo is that i make a list of things that i have in mind and were already suggested here on the forum and mailed to me. Then i could put those in a new topic together a little more info and discuss what could be done and what shouldn't be done, because i'd like to hear what the translators think about it before i make any major changes, after all, they are the one who need to use it.Just a few things that could be done:
- Making it easier for Plus! users to report a error in a translation.
- Allowing translators to change their emailadress (and maybe more) themselves.
- Allow translators to see a list with the details of others tranlators in their group.
- What is mentioned in this thread.
I believe i already menioned things like this in another threas, as you see, i still think the same
. But i'll need time to do it too.When i have a list i can ask Patchou what he thinks about it too.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Choli on 04-21-2004 at 03:34 PM
quote:imo, it's better and more secure to make a new program to do that.
Originally posted by KeyStorm
What I thought, if Choli doesn't care and has some spare time, is to distribute among all translators a special version of his Translator app that would upload the new/corrected file directly to the server. In that case, for safety, each copy of the Translator should be personalized with the nick of the owner and add it as comment in any translator file created with it to detect leaks immediately (hope you got my point ).
quote:patchou should add an option in the preferences or somewhere to report translation errors... (and clicking on that option will, for example, open a browser with a page where the user can report)
Originally posted by MenthiX
Making it easier for Plus! users to report a error in a translation.
quote:
Originally posted by MenthiX
Allowing translators to change their emailadress (and maybe more) themselves.
- Allow translators to see a list with the details of others tranlators in their group.
- What is mentioned in this thread.
once i wrote a post with the (imo) allowed acctions translators would be able to do. I can't find it right now
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by Patchou on 04-21-2004 at 06:23 PM
I've quickly read the first message of the thread and sorry but this will not be done. I've already often talked about internet download during the setup and I'm absolutely against it, for many reasons. I want to let people share Messenger Plus!, backup their favorite version on a CD, etc... my setup is one big chunk of program, everything is included in it, and it will stay that way.
As for updating the language automatically, it's actually a bad idea. That's how softwares like Linux get so messy. You need some people to control what's going on, or else,everything becomes chaotic. There's already a Language forum where peopel can post updates, then I can make the change once approved and the new translation file is released with the next version of Messenger Plus!. It may seem to be a little tedious but that way, everything keeps working fine and there's no risk that a lkanguage file become so bad that it has to be recreated from the beginning.
I hope I'm clear lol, I gotta go, sorry
Patchou
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by KeyStorm on 04-21-2004 at 06:26 PM
Patchou's arguments sound logical, nevertheless...
When... Let's leave it as an old suggestion, then.
RE: Language Downloader suggestion by saralk on 04-21-2004 at 09:02 PM
there should at least be a centralised place where you can get all the languages, like the plugins db, otherwise, for a [obscure language] speaker, it would be hard for him/her to find their language.
I wouldn't mind hosting it on my server.