What makes it tick? C++? VB? - Printable Version
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What makes it tick? C++? VB? by DJeX on 04-25-2004 at 07:22 AM
I was wondering, what is all windows programs written in. I heard most of them are in C++ is that true tho? What about VB?
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Stigmata on 04-25-2004 at 07:27 AM
depends which windows programs realy 
its possible to say, you can do alot more in c++
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Anubis on 04-25-2004 at 09:01 AM
I believe Calculator was made with Visual Basic (I don't have any ground for that it's just that making small applications like that is easy in VB). I don't know C++ nor do I pretend to but some stuff I see in Windows applications couldn't be done with VB. So it'd say it a mixture of both...
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Mike on 04-25-2004 at 09:26 AM
No calculator was made with C++.
If you reshack it will you see it thingys.
You cant do this if the program is writen with VB
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Anubis on 04-25-2004 at 09:52 AM
Yeah I just did it then...looks like I'm wrong 
...but it does look like a VB application...the first VB application I made was an adding machine actually...no point to it really...but I attached it so you can see where I was confused
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by CookieRevised on 04-25-2004 at 10:45 AM
quote:Looks doesn't matter and say nothing.... You can make the same in ASM if you like...
Originally posted by anubis_kree_
eah I just did it then...looks like I'm wrong ...but it does look like a VB application...the first VB application I made was an adding machine actually...
As far as I know, not a single application of Windows is made in VB, and all in C++...
quote:Reshacking doesn't say a thing also... A VB-application can also have resources to look at in reshack...
Originally posted by Mike2
If you reshack it will you see it thingys.
You cant do this if the program is writen with VB
Reshack only views RESOURCES, nothing more. If the program doesn't use resources then there is nothing to see (this goes for any programming language). Don't think of reshack as the ultimate tool of which you can do almost anything. I suggest to read about what resources actually are in the helpfile of reshack...
Although, this said... it is true that most VB programs don't have dialog and string resources (etc...) because the dialogs and strings the VB-program uses are stored in the compiled code and not in resources...
So instead of using reshack (which only can view resources which don't realy tell a thing), look at the program with a debugger tool or something to find out which DLL's the programs needs (also strong indicator) or use a hexadecimal/binary viewer to look at its bits and bytes. If the program isn't compressed with an executable-compressor, you can get very good hints there if you know what to look for:
a) __vbaxxxxx can indicate VB-programming. Although C++ programs in theory could also use these routines, 99% changes are you got a VB-program...
b) MSVBxxxxx.DLL is a typical DLL needed for VB-programming.
c) text1, text2, Frame1, Frame2 are standard default names for controls and frames in VB. This also indicates that the programmer didn't change the default names to a more proper name (lazyness?).
d) Project1 is the default name for a new project you make in VB. (Again lazyness?)
e) FRM_SIMPLE is a typical indication/name of a simple frame in VB.
f) Browsing thru the bits and bytes, you will always find huge gaps with nothing in VB-programs.
g) R6009, R6002 are typical errornumbers in C++.
h) You often find these kind of routines in C++-programs.
i) Microsoft Visual C++ Runtime Library... Need I say more ...
j) msvcrt.dll is a typical DLL needed for VC++-programming.
And of course there are many more indicators. If you find many of those, you can be pretty sure of the language in which the program is written...
btw: Every programming language has his own typical "indicators" like that...
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Choli on 04-25-2004 at 11:38 AM
quote:there are a few (very few) that are written in asm like the kernel loader (boot manager) and maybe some parts ot ntdll.dll, hal.dll, etc (oh, well, they aren't applications, anyway...
Originally posted by CookieRevised
As far as I know, not a single application of Windows is made in VB, and all in C++...
)The rest, of course, are written in VC++.
About the rest of applications not included in the installation of Windows, they're written in C/C++ mostly, a few are in VB, a few (i'd say less then vb ones) in Delphi and the rest are in dodgy languages (asm, vprolog, powerbuilder, ...)
About M$ applications (windows' ones, office's ones, games, ....), I'd say they're all written in VC++.
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Kryptonate on 04-25-2004 at 11:58 AM
quote:In C++ too (at least if you use Dev-C++)
Originally posted by CookieRevised
d) Project1 is the default name for a new project you make in VB. (Again lazyness?)
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Mike on 04-25-2004 at 12:08 PM
quote:
Originally posted by TheBlasphemer
Anyway, VB is geh >:]
Dont get in your mouth vb
Anyway what i mean cookie is that you cant see anything with reshack if the program is made with vb...
How should i tell you...
I know a program that has many pics in it(in picture boxes) and i know that it is made with vb.
I open it with reshack and i cant see anything.
The only things i see are the icon of the exe and the version info...
If you open a program made with C/C++ you can see its forms, graphics etc...
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by CookieRevised on 04-25-2004 at 02:26 PM
Ah, ok, well that's actualy what I meant too.... 
But still... A program in VB can still have resources like dialogs, strings, etc... (and thus can be viewed with reshack). If that programs you're talking about used resources instead, you couldn't see a difference in reshack if it was made in VC or in VB. So that was my point. Also vice versa, it isn't because you can't see resources with reshack that the program is made in VB...
The only thing that is more certain is, if you KNOW a program is writen in VB, then most likely it won't have resources to look at with reshack. But don't put it the other way around
quote:Ah, didn't know that, but will it also show up at the same (relative of course) space? (on the example screenshots you can't see much, but I know you know what I mean
Originally posted by Kryptonate
quote:In C++ too (at least if you use Dev-C++)
Originally posted by CookieRevised
d) Project1 is the default name for a new project you make in VB. (Again lazyness?)
)
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by DJeX on 04-25-2004 at 09:21 PM
So if I were to make a program what programing language would work best to work in Windows? C++? or VB?
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Huuf on 04-25-2004 at 09:27 PM
IF I had more time I would learn C++ and program only in c++ but shame I don't have much time on my hand and so create VB programs
But C++ is LOTS better then VB (I freely admit it 
) VB limitates me in things, have to add other dll's, with c++ you can code mostly in 1 file.
p.s. maybe in the summer break I'll learn c++
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Choli on 04-25-2004 at 10:04 PM
quote:for small and easy programs, you can develop them in VB faster than in C. the language is easier and it's more visual. However If you want to create a powerful, optimized, complex program you'd better use C++. C++ offers all. If a thing can't be done in C++ it can't be done at all. C++, the language, is more complex than VB and has a lot of more things that the programmer must care and take in mind.
Originally posted by DJeX
So if I were to make a program what programing language would work best to work in Windows? C++? or VB?
well, the choice is yours
note: if you're new to programming (or new to windows programming) i'd suggest you to start with VB and then (if you want) change to C++
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Huuf on 04-25-2004 at 10:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
well, the choice is yours
note: if you're new to programming (or new to windows programming) i'd suggest you to start with VB and then (if you want) change to C++
I'm not fully agreed with this, because the switching can be harder, because in vb you have to do things different ways (like if then else things)
I think it's adviced to buy some c++ books and then start learning
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by DJeX on 04-25-2004 at 11:50 PM
I agree with Huuf, I programed in VB for about 2 years now and find it really hard to learn C++. I almost have to pull my hair out trying to make a C++ program lol. Like Huuf said it's probably a good idea to get some C++ books and start learning.
Oh and what about the Visual Basic Scripting? .VBS file. Whats that used for?
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Choli on 04-26-2004 at 12:43 PM
quote:I'm not sure... if you start with C++, your learning curve may be frustrating... it'd take lot of time to get some "decent" results. However, stating with VB will show you then main concepts in windows programming and at the same time you'll be getting good, satisfactory results that will for sure motivate you in continue learning.
Originally posted by Huuf
I'm not fully agreed with this, because the switching can be harder, because in vb you have to do things different ways (like if then else things)
I think it's adviced to buy some c++ books and then start learning
Of course VB and C++ are diferent languages and so they have diferent lexical constructions (as huuf says, in VB an if structure is
code:and the same in C++ is
if bla then
bla
bla
else
bla
bla
end if
code:)
if (bla) {
bla;
bla;
} else {
bla;
bla;
}
However, that's a thing you have to assume when you're trying to learn diferent programming languages.
quote:do you think that if you hadn't begun with VB programming your first C++ program would have been easier? My personal experience is: I started with VB and Pascal, and then when I satarted with C I had the same problems as people who their 1st language is C. The same when I started with C++.
Originally posted by DJeX
I agree with Huuf, I programed in VB for about 2 years now and find it really hard to learn C++. I almost have to pull my hair out trying to make a C++ program lol.
quote:that of course
Originally posted by DJeX
Like Huuf said it's probably a good idea to get some C++ books and start learning.
if you start with VB, or if your 1st language is C++, a good book about C++ is needed 
(for example, VB can be learnt without books, C++ can't)quote:well, vbs files are not compiled but interpreted.. they're used to make "quick programs" (and some virus too
Originally posted by DJeX
Oh and what about the Visual Basic Scripting? .VBS file. Whats that used for?
). they're similar to what bat files are for ms-dos. Well, i don't kow very much about them. I can't program a VBS file (although the syntax is very similar to the VB one)
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by CookieRevised on 04-26-2004 at 06:20 PM
I fully agree with Choli... And I'll try to put it/explain in another way:
It's not because you are used to a certain syntax of a certain programming language that you will have more difficulty learning the new language. On the controrary! It will be easier (especially from VB to C, in comparison with nothing to C) why? Because if you can program in VB you know the "programming-principles" (hopefully 
) and for every language this is the same. This means: you think like a computer... You can "see" the solution before you've programmed it... You can tackle a problem in the "computer"-way... The only new thing you need to learn is the new syntax; You don't need to learn "programming" again...
If you hadn't know any programming language and hadn't "experienced" programming yet, not only you need to learn the syntax, but also you must learn to program....
About VBS: It's indeed something between VBA (Visual Basic for Applications (interpreted, not compiled) = the things of what macro's are made of in Word, Excel, etc for example) and DOS Batch-programming. Syntax is the same VB.
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Choli on 04-26-2004 at 10:10 PM
Thanks Cookie for making it clearer. In fact it's just this:
quote:and let me add: " and knowing them is easier in VB than in C++"
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Because if you can program in VB you know the "programming-principles"
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by DJeX on 04-29-2004 at 02:28 AM
Well I have finaly made up my mind, i'm going to learn C++. Any good sugestions or books I could use to use to learn this? I got some books off Kazaa but nothing really good.
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by Wabz on 04-29-2004 at 03:14 PM
quote:
Originally posted by DJeX
Well I have finaly made up my mind, i'm going to learn C++. Any good sugestions or books I could use to use to learn this? I got some books off Kazaa but nothing really good.
Learn C++ in 24 hours is a great guide I just bought it
It looks nice and it has a simple layout. all I need now is to open it and start learning
RE: What makes it tick? C++? VB? by DJeX on 04-30-2004 at 01:05 AM
I just downloaded Learn Visual C++ in 21 Days off kazaa and it's great! I recomend this book. 