Request: A translation program for website translation - Printable Version
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Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-01-2004 at 10:30 AM
Just as the title says, is there anyone going to make a translation program for the website translation? 
In my view, I think one of the key feature the program should have is translation from/to non-western characters (such as Chinese characters) ,to/from the #xxxxx number.
That would make things a lot easier. Anyone? 
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by CookieRevised on 06-01-2004 at 11:57 AM
true... but that will require a huuuuuuuuuge list to be implemented... would be good though... Choli? 
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-01-2004 at 02:00 PM
quote:doesn't frontpage suit your needs?
Originally posted by Mnjul
Just as the title says, is there anyone going to make a translation program for the website translation?
quote:no. the xxxxx is just the unicode code, so it's quite easy
Originally posted by CookieRevised
but that will require a huuuuuuuuuge list to be implemented
quote:ehh! why me? j/k
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Choli?
I can adapt the translator, it'd be quite easy, however I haven't time to do it, sorry. Next week I have 3 final exams and haven't still started to study them. Also I have to finish 2 programs I have to do for the Uni (one of them hasn't still got any line of code). (and I have to translate the web page too
)Maybe this summer I'd do it, for future translations. This time, I'm afraid we'd have to translate it using notepad and frontpage.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-01-2004 at 02:48 PM
Frontpage s***s 
I'll turn to Dreamweaver if it does the job too...if not, I think it would take a week or two (or even longer) before you see Plus! site in Chinese Traditioal 
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-01-2004 at 03:18 PM
quote:Dreamweaver will sure do. In case it doesn't, try looking for another program, like homesite (<- i think that is its name)
Originally posted by Mnjul
I'll turn to Dreamweaver if it does the job too...
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-01-2004 at 03:26 PM
Well, in case it doesn't, I will just write a small VB program that translates Chinese characters to/from &#xxxxx things...it couldn't be very hard as I suppose AscW is what I need.
RE: RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Tarry on 06-01-2004 at 03:52 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mnjul
Frontpage s***s
Why don't you use a text editor which suports PHP, like EditPlus?
I'm using it and it works properly.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by CookieRevised on 06-01-2004 at 04:15 PM
quote:Yes, the unicodes itself are, but there are also the many (ansi) entities which use a code not a number.
Originally posted by Choli
no. the xxxxx is just the unicode code, so it's quite easy
Example ü = ü and that list is very huge... (and ü is normal ansi, not unicode)
quote:What are you still doing here then
Originally posted by Choli
Next week I have 3 final exams and haven't still started to study them. Also I have to finish 2 programs I have to do for the Uni (one of them hasn't still got any line of code). (and I have to translate the web page too )
anyways, good luck with your exams, I hope you'll pass them 
.quote:You don't need a PHP-enabled teksteditor, any normal teksteditor will do fine (like notepad). The reason why a translator program would be great is the same reason why "Choli's Translator" is so great: because you have a nice overview of all the keys and their original English text...
Originally posted by Tarry
Why don't you use a text editor which suports PHP, like EditPlus?
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-01-2004 at 04:42 PM
quote:maybe because it doesn't handle unicode characters properly
Originally posted by Tarry
Why don't you use a text editor which suports PHP, like EditPlus
quote:i know, the same with áéíóúñ
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Yes, the unicodes itself are, but there are also the many (ansi) entities which use a code not a number.
Example ü = ü and that list is very huge... (and ü is normal ansi, not unicode)
but Patchou put #xxxx (with the #) so i thought about unicode numbers.
quote:thanks... I'm too lazy to start studing
Originally posted by CookieRevised
What are you still doing here then anyways, good luck with your exams, I hope you'll pass them
RE: RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Tarry on 06-01-2004 at 06:02 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
maybe because it doesn't handle unicode characters properly
Well, just tested it, and EditPlus supports Unicode perfectly.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
The reason why a translator program would be great is the same reason why "Choli's Translator" is so great: because you have a nice overview of all the keys and their original English text...
Cookie, you're right. Choli's Translator is so great and it will be very useful to have it for website translation!
So Choli, you know what you have to do!
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by CookieRevised on 06-02-2004 at 12:04 AM
He knows, he needs to study
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-02-2004 at 09:09 AM
quote:even with chinesse chars? ok that's good
Originally posted by Tarry
Well, just tested it, and EditPlus supports Unicode perfectly.
<- Mnjul take note quote:
Originally posted by Tarry
Cookie, you're right. Choli's Translator is so great and it will be very useful to have it for website translation!
So Choli, you know what you have to do!
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
I can adapt the translator, it'd be quite easy, however I haven't time to do it, sorry. Next week I have 3 final exams and haven't still started to study them. Also I have to finish 2 programs I have to do for the Uni (one of them hasn't still got any line of code). (and I have to translate the web page too )
Maybe this summer I'd do it, for future translations. This time, I'm afraid we'd have to translate it using notepad and frontpage.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-02-2004 at 11:01 AM
Well, I just tried a minute ago. As Dreamweaver does the "&#xxxxx from/to characters translation" very properly, I think I'll stick to it. I have been using it to work on my personal website in PHP and HTML and DW is just good handling pages with different encoding In case you don't know, Dreamweaver is not bad for basic PHP editing
Now the problem I have is to find a couple good Messenger resouce sites in Chinese Traditional.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Tarry on 06-02-2004 at 03:27 PM
Well, there aren't a lot of good Messenger websites in catalan
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-02-2004 at 03:59 PM
quote:If you're finally gonna put sites in spanish, i'd suggest messengeradictos.com , and if you know any more, tell me, 'cause i can't find good sites either.
Originally posted by Tarry
Well, there aren't a lot of good Messenger websites in catalan
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by CookieRevised on 06-02-2004 at 04:11 PM
same here... many dutch sites though... but can't find any good ones... the ones that have some info (besides the normal downloads) are often very incorrect or incomplete with there 'info'...
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Tarry on 06-02-2004 at 07:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
If you're finally gonna put sites in spanish,
We have to discuss it, at that moment, we've put ErezaTrans which has a patch to translate MSN Messenger into Catalan, and perhaps we'll put some sites in Spanish... (that's in the TO-DO list of the Catalan Translation).
I knew about MessengerAdictos.com, but since they've redesigned the site a few months ago I don't like it
quote:
Originally posted by Choli
quote:
Originally posted by Tarry
Cookie, you're right. Choli's Translator is so great and it will be very useful to have it for website translation!
So Choli, you know what you have to do!quote:
Originally posted by Choli
I can adapt the translator, it'd be quite easy, however I haven't time to do it, sorry. Next week I have 3 final exams and haven't still started to study them. Also I have to finish 2 programs I have to do for the Uni (one of them hasn't still got any line of code). (and I have to translate the web page too )
Maybe this summer I'd do it, for future translations. This time, I'm afraid we'd have to translate it using notepad and frontpage.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
He knows, he needs to study
Please, don't bite me!
I know he needs to study, as most of us, I meant when he has some time to do it! I'm very absent-minded, and I left it when I was writing the message!
Sometimes, as I'm so absend-minded, I have to do double-posting... Well, until I learnt how to edit posts
(I meant, until I learnt people preferred editing posts instead of double-spamming-posting).
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Kian on 06-03-2004 at 03:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mnjul
Just as the title says, is there anyone going to make a translation program for the website translation?
In my view, I think one of the key feature the program should have is translation from/to non-western characters (such as Chinese characters) ,to/from the #xxxxx number.
That would make things a lot easier. Anyone?
Uuuhm as far as I know this translation is not a killer. Anyway it'll take an eternity to include all the web-safe shorts &xxxxx
But I support this request... Choli! Go make us a program...
// Kian
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by sock on 06-10-2004 at 09:51 AM
I could not find any place in FrontPage to change the encoding, which kinda pissed me off. Dreamweaver actually did it, but it was a nightmare to work with because of its high resource usage and awful RTL input support. So I uninstalled it. 
I'm personally planning on convincing Patchou to use standard Hebrew Web character encoding. I wonder if that'll work. 
RE: RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Kian on 06-10-2004 at 11:58 AM
quote:
Originally posted by sock
I could not find any place in FrontPage to change the encoding, which kinda pissed me off. Dreamweaver actually did it, but it was a nightmare to work with because of its high resource usage and awful RTL input support. So I uninstalled it.
...erhm... DreamWeaver does not use that much CPU - not more that other programs... once I had the same problem (enormous usage of CPU) but a re-install corrected that problem
Try install it again - it is actually a great program (compared to FrontPage, FrontPage stinks)
Anyway why is it that nobody merges those two programs into a single program? I think this is the third upcomming program for translators...
// Kian
"lets get one thing straight... i'm not"
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-10-2004 at 06:16 PM
quote:what is that Hebrew web char. encoding? any special way of encoding??
Originally posted by sock
I'm personally planning on convincing Patchou to use standard Hebrew Web character encoding.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by sock on 06-14-2004 at 04:44 AM
@Kian: What bothers me is mainly the usage of the paging file, not the CPU. FrontPage 2003 is nothing like its predecessors, and I like it better because it's simpler/lighter and it supports Hebrew well, even if it has less features.
quote:I don't know what you know and don't know about this business, but I'll explain it anyway...
Originally posted by Choli
what is that Hebrew web char. encoding? any special way of encoding??
The actual character encoding I'm talking about is simply 1-byte ASCII: A certain range of characters in the second half of the ASCII table is reserved for international symbols - and each character set has different letters for the same range. If I type some Hebrew words in Notepad, save them as ASCII and send to you, you would see Latin characters (no matter what OS we have, it's still ASCII). That's why this method is problematic, and Unicode replaced it.
Unicode shows exactly the same thing everywhere. Indeed, universal code. So why not use Unicode on the Web? I suppose it might not work on pre-Unicode systems (I've never tried it). But it's also a waste of space and bandwidth, as Unicode characters are dual-byte (so they can contain all of the letters in the world).
So what's the solution? Using good old ASCII, and specifying a character set so the Web browser knows what letters to display. So I just save the PHP file as plain ASCII, and then Patchou could add the following line inside the <head> section of the Web pages which display the translation:
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=windows-1255">
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-14-2004 at 11:04 AM
quote:
Originally posted by sock
I suppose it might not work on pre-Unicode systems (I've never tried it)
Well, if I get you right, what you said actually works
. A UTF-8 encoded page can be viewed correctly in Windows Me (under IE6). At least that's what I've tried - the Japanese characters and Chinese characters did show in my page -, so I suppose that a Unicode-encoded page still works (showing characters appropriately) under non-unicode windows (95/98/Me) 
Also, the charset tag has actually been added to the page
quote:Really? I think it is the browsers that "interprets" the meta tag...
Originally posted by sock
This will tell the HTTP server to include that information when sending the file's header to Web browsers.
If you use php, the server head thing must be output with Header function, I think...
Well, I could be wrong anyway
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Choli on 06-14-2004 at 11:34 AM
quote:yep, I thought you meant anything different from unicode. Thanks, anyway
Originally posted by sock
I don't know what you know and don't know about this business, but I'll explain it anyway...
quote:yes, it's the browser who interprets that. The META HTTP-EQUIV tag is sent inside the page and it's up to the browser care about it. However there may be a way that php can tell apache to send a special header with the same pourpose. In that case you won't see it in the code of the page
Originally posted by Mnjul
Really? I think it is the browsers that "interprets" the meta tag... If you use php, the server head thing must be output with Header function, I think... Well, I could be wrong anyway
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by Mnjul on 06-14-2004 at 11:38 AM
quote:Yep there is, just use this Header output:
Originally posted by Choli
yes, it's the browser who interprets that. The META HTTP-EQUIV tag is sent inside the page and it's up to the browser care about it. However there may be a way that php can tell apache to send a special header with the same pourpose. In that case you won't see it in the code of the page
header("Content-Type: text/html; charset=Blahblahblah");
However I suspect that Meta tag overrides this header when interpreted by the browser.
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by sock on 06-15-2004 at 08:06 AM
quote:Then the reasons are bandwidth/storage economy, and perhaps browser/OS compatibility.
Originally posted by Mnjul
A UTF-8 encoded page can be viewed correctly in Windows Me (under IE6).
As for the META HTTP-EQUIV tag, I could very possibly be wrong about what I said - but one thing's for sure, it does not override the server's header information. How do I know? The exact same HTML code (a Hebrew page with the above META tag included) was displayed fine (ie. in Hebrew) on one server, while on the other it wasn't.
I'm not sure exactly how this stuff works, but obviously the problematic server was sending wrong language information in the header, and it was overiding the META tag. Using header() with PHP corrected this behavior in the problematic server:
<? header("Content-type: text/html; charset=windows-1255"); ?>
All this made me theorize that HTTP servers interpret the META tag - and that the problematic server didn't do it (because of its configuration). But since the idea of the Web server interpreting META tags does seem strange, now I suspect that the problematic server was forcing western (Latin based) letters on all its pages, while the other one let the browser decide on it.
Time will tell what the case will be with the HTTP server on msgplus.net...
RE: Request: A translation program for website translation by WDZ on 06-15-2004 at 08:37 AM
quote:Yep... I think it's time for a w3.org quote.
Originally posted by sock
As for the META HTTP-EQUIV tag, I could very possibly be wrong about what I said - but one thing's for sure, it does not override the server's header information. How do I know? The exact same HTML code (a Hebrew page with the above META tag included) was displayed fine (ie. in Hebrew) on one server, while on the other it wasn't.
quote:
http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/charset.html#h-5.2.2
...conforming user agents must observe the following priorities when determining a document's character encoding (from highest priority to lowest):
- An HTTP "charset" parameter in a "Content-Type" field.
- A META declaration with "http-equiv" set to "Content-Type" and a value set for "charset".
- The charset attribute set on an element that designates an external resource.