Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program.

Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. - Printable Version

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+----- Thread: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. (/showthread.php?tid=32164)

Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by XM4ST3RX on 09-27-2004 at 03:36 AM

Hi,
It appears that many, many users are having problems with the software solely based on the fact of the sponsor software.

Now most of us all know that you can opt out of the sponsor program by selecting i refuse... however...

Most install software asks for you to accept or refuse the terms of the program etc before you can continue to install it... now what i believe is that many new users think it's the same sorta thing without carefully reading it...

I do believe it is sort of mis-leading.

I am a big supporter of Messenger Plus, and believe i will always continue to be so... however about 10% of the Messenger Plus users seem to be angry because of the fact of the mis-leading sponsor program, or some dont even realise, and just get angry because they think it came batched with aload of spyware....

What my question is, is why does it appear mis-leading? Why not display a large red warning notice, so people DO KNOW they are about to install the sponsor software to support Messenger Plus.

Also another suggestion is instead of having that sponsor program, mis-leading alot of Messenger Plus users... why not have a donation page? I'm sure alot of people would donate, and alot more people would be happy with the end result.

Many Thanks,
XM4ST3RX

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Chrono on 09-27-2004 at 03:40 AM

quote:
Originally posted by XM4ST3RX
What my question is, is why does it appear mis-leading? Why not display a large red warning notice, so people DO KNOW they are about to install the sponsor software to support Messenger Plus.

if he putted a big red message he would scare everyone even if they really wanted to install the sponsor

If he didnt want people to install it, he wouldnt have a sponsor at all

quote:
Originally posted by XM4ST3RX
why not have a donation page?

he had a donation page before, but almost no one donated

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Patchou on 09-27-2004 at 03:44 AM

Chromo speaks the truth.

The donation page online formore than a year and only about 10 people over 2 million donated. As forthe sponsor agreement, it'a also true that I can't add too much "are you reall reall really sure?" notices, else, nobody will install it anymore . I thank you for yourpost and ideas, but the waythings are working currently is probably the best way... some people will always complain, even if 10 confirmation messages are displayed, this forum is here to help them and when they don't want to hear what we have to say to them, the problem because theirs.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by XM4ST3RX on 09-27-2004 at 03:45 AM

ok... so no-one donated... so the alternative is to have a mis-leading sponsor program?

most people would probably rather pay for Messenger Plus, rather than have their PC full of spyware.

Thanks,
XM4ST3RX

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by lopardo on 09-27-2004 at 03:49 AM

quote:
Originally posted by XM4ST3RX

I do believe it is sort of mis-leading.

I agree.

quote:
Originally posted by XM4ST3RX
Also another suggestion is instead of having that sponsor program, mis-leading alot of Messenger Plus users... why not have a donation page? I'm sure alot of people would donate, and alot more people would be happy with the end result.

Are you really sure about that? :undecided:

As Chrono said, he had a donation page before, but almost no one donated.

quote:
Originally posted by Chrono

quote:
Originally posted by XM4ST3RX
What my question is, is why does it appear mis-leading? Why not display a large red warning notice, so people DO KNOW they are about to install the sponsor software to support Messenger Plus.
if he putted a big red message he would scare everyone even if they really wanted to install the sponsor
If he didnt want people to install it, he wouldnt have a sponsor at all

I agree with Chrono here. I think it should be something like this (sorry for insisting).

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by RaceProUK on 09-27-2004 at 06:50 AM

I'm going along with lopardo on this one: that screenie of his looks like it could work.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Fred Greg on 09-28-2004 at 09:56 AM

I also agree with raceprouk & lopardo. What irony! The very problem he's trying to clear up in his name! - Name it, people! LOP! Live Online Portal! Are you afraid user's'll be scared off by it's reputation? Come to think of it - you probably are...

Well, here's an expanded version of lopardo's idea - have the explanation screen, then the LOP license, but on the explanation screen, explain exactly what LOP is, & how this version is different to the spyware/porn popper/hijacker versions.

Sorry if that was a bit psycho,
Fred Greg.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by TheDude on 09-28-2004 at 02:44 PM

Patchou should keep it how it is: the people who complain bring it upon themselves by not reading a contract that they agree to. If the sponsor program funds Messenger Plus! then I'm glad it is there, and people should stop moaning!

quote:
most people would probably rather pay for Messenger Plus, rather than have their PC full of spyware.

And no, I would not rather play for plus! than have an OPTIONAL adware program! I would rather pay than have my "PC full of spyware" but:

1.)It's OPTIONAL
2.) It's ADWARE and not SPYWARE.

[/rant]

EDIT: I guess the only possible reason Patchou would have for changing it would be if it were being counter-productive, IE word goes around that "Plus has adware" and thus less people download it, and thus the sponsorship is less valuable. But unless that is happening, it should stay how it is.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Anubis on 09-28-2004 at 03:21 PM

Personally I'd like a message at the top in Red saying "please read carefully this is not the usual yada yada" like the IE Google toolbar installation does...

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by reisyboy on 09-28-2004 at 03:43 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Patchou
Chromo speaks the truth.

love that

Well ill be honest if people dont read then of kind of is their own fault. Patchou has already set it to be no default clicked yes. And and has put capital letters there so it does draw attention to itself... But then again your right people dont read... but if a person often installs software like that they should know how to remove it - as people who often charge through the installs know what they are doing as they do it alot.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by saralk on 09-28-2004 at 08:12 PM

The major problem is IMO, is people who think their really good running a software like adaware and then using that to uninstall the spyware.

Since Messenger Plus is a normal piece of software, and so is the sponser software, why dont people do the logical thing and uninstall plus

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Fred Greg on 09-29-2004 at 03:17 AM

The option that says "I refuse, do not install the sponsor program" (word for word) makes it look like it'll prevent installation if you click it, & since that'll stop most people clicking on it, they'll never find out that you can in fact install without LOP (the sponsor).

It'd be better if it said "I refuse, install Plus! without the sponsor program." This would help prevent confusion. As has been mentioned, people don't read license agreements, & so it is their own fault to a large degree if they don't want LOP & they get it, but when you see something that looks like it says you have to choose yes, you'll generally choose yes if you want Plus!.

Also, the sponsor license itself (which is the only one, so it looks at a glance like the one for Plus!) contains "IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF THIS END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT AND THE PRIVACY POLICY, YOU WILL NOT BE PERMITTED TO INSTALL THE SOFTWARE." in it's preface, before it defines the "SOFTWARE" as being LOP, rather than Plus!

It's fine that it's there, but I really do reckon it should be clearer.

Fred Greg.

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Bomber2k on 09-30-2004 at 11:30 AM

Please remove the automatic installation of 'aditional software'. All we want is Plus! and I know that you must make money... but there must be another way.

If I were coding a anti-spyware program, i'd put Plus! on the list of spyware. People don't like spyware, no one does. You're trying to get money the wrong way!!! I doubt if LOP actually makes much either.

Plus, LOP is almost impossible to get rid of. You can't easily kill some of its many processes (lol i know, Linux > Windows in this respect), so how is someone to remove this junk?

It's like a virus! Adaware DOES NOT REMOVE IT!

Also, someone might not be able to read English very well, and would install the spyware unkowingly! Perhaps they don't read it?

Please remove the tick out of the spyware installation box.

PATCHYOU, DO YOU USE THE SPYWARE PROGRAM YOURSELF?
I bet you don't. You are deliberatively tricking people into installing spyware. The spyware could actually be classed as a virus.

How do you feel about spreading viruses? I hope you hear from the law soon enough...

RE: RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by CookieRevised on 09-30-2004 at 11:55 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
Please remove the automatic installation of 'aditional software'. All we want is Plus! and I know that you must make money... but there must be another way.

No there isn't atm. Patchou have explained this many many times before why he choosed for this approach, search the forums.

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
If I were coding a anti-spyware program, i'd put Plus! on the list of spyware.

The sponsor is not spyware, it is adware! Huge difference there!! You might want to check up on the difference before you attempt to write such a program. Furthermore, it is the sponsor which is adware, not Plus!

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
People don't like spyware, no one does. You're trying to get money the wrong way!!! I doubt if LOP actually makes much either.

It gives him enough to live on and to develop Plus! further. Also, the wrong way? May I ask you a question? Did you pay for every piece of software on your PC (including all your downloaded songs)? I doubt it....

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
Plus, LOP is almost impossible to get rid of. You can't easily kill some of its many processes (lol i know, Linux > Windows in this respect), so how is someone to remove this junk?

The sponsor is very easly uninstalled if you simply uninstall Plus!. And that would only take less then 5 minutes to do.

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
It's like a virus! Adaware DOES NOT REMOVE IT!

It is nothing like a virus! Ad-aware doesn't remove it because Ad-aware is only a tool to track _some_ adware. Ad-ware isn't the holy grale. How can 1 program know every possible kind of adware/spyware and know how to exactly remove things? If such things were possible then Windows would not need a software-panel to uninstall programs. And programs would not need a uninstall procedure.

It strikes me that so many people trust software like ad-aware to completely uninstall things, while the logic and proper way is to execute the uninstall procedures of the program in question (and yes, that goes even for most adware! Yes, they even have uninstallers which completely remove the adware! So why is it so unlogic to use that once you found the adware?????????).....

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
Also, someone might not be able to read English very well, and would install the spyware unkowingly! Perhaps they don't read it?

That's why the first paragraph of the sponsor agreement, and the whole setup (including the options to choose from) are translated when you install Plus! in another language!!

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
PATCHYOU, DO YOU USE THE SPYWARE PROGRAM YOURSELF?
I bet you don't.

Yes he does use the searchbar!

quote:
Originally posted by Bomber2k
The spyware could actually be classed as a virus.

Get your facts strait.
1) it is adware...
2) adware is not spyware
3) spyware is not a virus

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by BEWARE^^ on 09-30-2004 at 08:17 PM

btw this should clear somethings up about the sponser program

http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=32230

RE: Patchou - Optional Sponsor Program. by Patchou on 09-30-2004 at 09:07 PM

I think that very valid points I've been made here, there's no poitn in keeping this thread opened, starting to compare the sponsorwith a virus is absurd. Please read the arguments other people on this forum are giving. As for the sponsor making money, may I remind you that duringthe first 6 months of 2004, Google made 1.6 BILLION in advertisement revenues? Of course, that's easy for them, everybody is happy to install their search bar, despite the fact that it's basic principles are exactly the same as the one from my sponsor: return sponsored results on top of the search page. I don't see Adaware trying to remove it by screwing up its files though.