Talking on MSN, I told friend of mine that someone got banned for putting a confirmation email on a blog about testing Plus! Live, he had this to say (Warning: contains strong language!):

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nah im thankfull he made plus, but I hate how many fucking mindless idiots WORSHIP himyou go in the forum and it's like "omgzorz 1 luv p4tchooozz. It's influence of the mob, you'll notice by visiting the plus forum regularly that if you even THINK negative thoughts about patch your a "disgrace to the community" and no one DARES leak because i love patchou and they love patchou and anything patchou says is god and omg patchou so cool, patchou we all love... I mean fo rfucks sake let go of it already, it's a nice peice of software with nice features and a nice bundled spyware to get patchou his money, but everyone has to bitch about WLM and leak it, why? Because the people who make it and bust their ass a LOT more then P dont post on a fucking forum asking people to "submit pictures of their tree" or suggest impossibly noobisg features like block checking in plus? I say fuck them, leak it, let people who WANT to use the beta USE it. What harm could it do?The ones who would be sad because it fucks their MSN or Windows probably wouldnt know how to get the leak, let alone be testing WLM.now put all that together, quote it, and post it in the forum saying the person who said it wants to remain anonymmous. And by the way, dont get me wrong, I think Patchou did a great job, that he put's lot's of effort into Plus! and I also must say the community has some really nice people but...

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wow  haha !! that man is so angry !! :

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Originally posted by zaher1988
wow  haha !! that man is so angry !! :

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1) Most of the people here are not "fucking mindless idiots worshipping" Patchou at all...

If something has to be said negativly towards him or Plus!, people will say it, no matter what!. The fact is that the people here appreciate and respect the skills and effort Patchou puts into his software, nothing more, nothing less.

In fact, if you look closer to the forum, you'll see a lot of critics too. But it is of course very convenient for the sake of blog ranting to ignore those posts...

2) Leaking is bad, wheither it is Plus! or a product from Microsoft. If you can't understand the reason why, or can't see why leaking actually WILL harm a product development then you need to grow out of your 13-year old "script-kiddy" attitude and do some research on how software is made, bug-fixed and released.

3) People will not leak software because of the stuff said in point 2 and because out of respect of the developper, no matter if it was Patchou, MS or whatever... Respect you clearly don't have; no surprising though, reading your rant and the way you think...

4) Nevertheless, you are entitled to your opinion of course. But the way you rant (an thus think) about this also shows that you don't have a clear view/knowledge on the things you talk about... (not to mention not much respect, if not nothing at all, for other people's products!!!)

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Originally posted by Dragular
but...

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Haha, that loser really needs to get a life.  He sounds like an Emo 14 year old who is jealous of Patchou so he has to try and bash him and his supporters.  Well, I know he's reading this, so this next part is to him.  Guess what fucknut?  You create a quality piece of software with over 6 million users, YOU devote your money to it, and then maybe, just MAYBE, someone will respect you.  Right now though from your comments, its quite evident that you are a shit stain upon this earth right now and have no life whatsoever.  So why dont you take your negative energy and self loathing and shove it straight the fuck up your ass, cause we dont want to hear it.  Are you fucking afraid we will all bash you if you come say it yourself, or are you just that fucking immature to fight your own battle?

Have a nice day, Loser.

Hm, was interesting and funny .

1. We can take negative critisism about Plus! or Patchou, as long as it is based on truth or well build. 

2. As CookieRevised already said, we're not all 'fucking mindless idiots worshipping' Patchou, don't tell everyone is the same because maybe a few act that way.

3. Plus! doesn't get leaked not because we "worship" Patchou but because we know how much work he put in to it and we respect that. Don't compare Plus! beta-testing to WLM beta testing. The WLM beta testers aren't the same as the Plus! beta testers. Not all people want to leak software.

4. I think it's stupid advise saying "leak it" as you should ALWAYS be carefull with a beta. A beta isn't finished yet, is filled with bugs and is for testing purposes only, not for fun (well, not in the first place ).

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What harm could it do?The ones who would be sad because it fucks their MSN or Windows probably wouldnt know how to get the leak, let alone be testing WLM.

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Because the people who make it and bust their ass a LOT more then P

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Originally posted by Dragular

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i love patchou and they love patchou and anything patchou says is god and omg patchou so cool, patchou we all love...

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Originally posted by damm-o
i think hes timothy

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It's easy to seek attention by badmouthing someone else. Only it would be more impressive if the badmouther could prove he could do a better job than Patchou. 

I think it's rather cowardice to state shit anonymously. Be a man, if you have an opinion, stand for it and state it loudly and proudly.

not that tymothy

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Originally posted by MenthiX
Doubt it, mess.be and Patchou are good friends

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Ah, lol. I just assumed it was the only Timothy in messenger world i know . My bad.

Shrink worthy rant me thinks. .

hahahah the guy who made it knows nothing

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Originally posted by MenthiX


Ah, lol. I just assumed it was the only Timothy in messenger world i know (Smilie). My bad.

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Just another loser.

Next, please!

1) I might be looked at a little badly, but I think he is right about the whole "worship Patchou thing". Don't take me wrong though, I am one of these who respect Patchou a lot. I think what he's done is amazing, and so much investment of time in this software is just spectacular, this is one of the reason I decided to apply for beta-testing, because I love his idea of the software, and I want to help out as much as possible.

But I think some people have a little more than respect for him.. We do jump on people who say some bad stuff about him, and though I am one of the firsts to stand by his side when MP! is being accused of anything, (as the bundled adware) I think some of the replys that members give out, a lot of times provocative and mean, make it sound like if he was our God.

2) I think if I had to give more credits to Patch or the MSN Messenger team ( WLM developpers team now ) I would go to Patchou for a few reasons :

-He's working by himself to make this software available to everyone
-He's doing it for free, yes, he does get a little benifit from the adaware, but mostly it's a contribution he's giving out to the community, compared to Microsoft who do this as a living.

This doesn't mean I do not respect Microsoft, I will not leak neither MP! L. or WLM, for a lot of reasons. When it comes to leaking, a lot of factors come in the count, which explains why Microsoft or other big companies wait a lot before making a beta public.

Some of these factors could mainly be the fact that the bugs could make anyone dislike the software, therefore when it is bug free, not install it. A lot of other reasons can be given, but I will not get into them, seeing as I am not the best person to answer that question.

I hope people will not take this post negativly, this is simply what I feel, and my truest opinion of things.

I was expecting something worthwhile for reading... haha... proved me wrong.

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Originally posted by Dragular
Talking on MSN, I told friend of mine that someone got banned for putting a confirmation email on a blog about testing Plus! Live, he had this to say (Warning: contains strong language!):

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nah im thankfull he made plus, but I hate how many fucking mindless idiots WORSHIP himyou go in the forum and it's like "omgzorz 1 luv p4tchooozz. It's influence of the mob, you'll notice by visiting the plus forum regularly that if you even THINK negative thoughts about patch your a "disgrace to the community" and no one DARES leak because i love patchou and they love patchou and anything patchou says is god and omg patchou so cool, patchou we all love... I mean fo rfucks sake let go of it already, it's a nice peice of software with nice features and a nice bundled spyware to get patchou his money, but everyone has to bitch about WLM and leak it, why? Because the people who make it and bust their ass a LOT more then P dont post on a fucking forum asking people to "submit pictures of their tree" or suggest impossibly noobisg features like block checking in plus? I say fuck them, leak it, let people who WANT to use the beta USE it. What harm could it do?The ones who would be sad because it fucks their MSN or Windows probably wouldnt know how to get the leak, let alone be testing WLM.now put all that together, quote it, and post it in the forum saying the person who said it wants to remain anonymmous. And by the way, dont get me wrong, I think Patchou did a great job, that he put's lot's of effort into Plus! and I also must say the community has some really nice people but...

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There you go.

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Originally posted by Dragular
Talking on MSN, I told friend of mine that someone got banned for putting a confirmation email on a blog about testing Plus! Live, he had this to say (Warning: contains strong language!):

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Originally posted by Trunten

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Originally posted by Dragular
Talking on MSN, I told friend of mine that someone got banned for putting a confirmation email on a blog about testing Plus! Live, he had this to say (Warning: contains strong language!):

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I was the one who made the mistake about posting the email on my blog (see that other wlm topic).

No, that's not me who ranted that, and no, I don't know who it is.

Just had to say that for the record.

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Originally posted by joelm
Why did you post the e-mail on your blog man? thats just wrong

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Originally posted by ShawnZ

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Originally posted by joelm
Why did you post the e-mail on your blog man? thats just wrong

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because all it says is "welcome to the beta"? it's wrong to leak information sure, and rude to post emails too, but if you were thinking fast, the email didn't contain any information, and it was a personal blog, you might have done the same :/

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lol... well, just in case someone would have a doubt, please insult me, all of you, and let's keep track of the thread next time someone says everybody on this forum loves me. Sometimes people can get over excited about things/people, I appreciate the good and bad comments I get about Messenger Plus!, as long as they are based on something. If you have a doubt, just search for negative posts on this forum, you'll find plenty as I don't delete them. May I remind you that Plus! now has more than 10M users, out of those you can't blame 100 to jump of joy everytime I release a new version (and it always motivates me anyway ).

Now, as far as leaking the beta is concerned, it's something often only developers can understand. First of all, this is my software, I think I have the right to choose how it's distributed. It's not a matter of who wants to use the software here, it's first a matter of how the author wants his work to be used. Beta versions must not become public because they are buggy, not meant for general public, slow, full of problems, will crash Messenger and will make Microsoft contact me about fixing it.

Distributing beta software has become a fashion and is used by a lot of companies nowadays to justify bugs in their product. Example: Microsoft AntiSpyware. It's been in beta stage for I don't even remember how much time and everytime a big problem is detected, like for NAV recently, they conviniently reply that the software is beta and that people aren't supposed to install a beta product if they can't assume the consequences. Well, what they ommit to say is that they are promoting their beta software on the front page of microsoft.com.

I for one am not about to use the same strategy. I will NOT take you for idiots by releasing a beta product and wash my hands of whatever problem you may get with it. The fact of the matter is that I don't mind if someone more "techy" gets one of my internal betas and uses it. At this point, this person know what he/she is doing. What I don't want however is your friend's friend who is a basic computer user to get the beta because he won't understand what's behind it, he probably won't have any idea what a "beta" is and will consider this version like any other.

I hope I'm making sense for all of you.

well said patchou

Hm patchou, maybe (once of course it's been debugged enough) you could release a little preview release for those "more techy" people, on the forums? (bad idea but maybe a 100+ post only download system or something like that?) Maybe even just a limited feature set of what works to keep people hungry? =p

I suggest you read my other replies in the other topic. It was an honest mistake.

And yes, you're right, it wasn't anything really too personal. I wouldn't have shared anything truly confidential, or any builds.

I've all ready been dealt with, and if Patchou and the others want to talk to me personally, they can do so. All I wanted to do was simply defend myself. So I've said all I can for now.

Was just an accident is all. An oops.

I think it'd be a good idea if the rest of the staff here take my posts from today, and all the posts about what I did, into their staff areas before this gets more out of hand. If for any other reasons, so the topics get back on topic. They can feel free to contact me later to resolve this matter.

i love you patchou you are my "god"


jk

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Originally posted by Patchou
and that people aren't supposed to install a beta product if they can't assume the consequences. Well, what they ommit to say is that they are promoting their beta software on the front page of microsoft.com.

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Well, heres his awnser to your flamming written in a text doccument. Enjoy.

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I'm a loser? I'm emo? I'm 14? I'm gay? I need a shrink? I hate everyone? I'm stupid? I don't respect Patchou?

What you are going to do, is try to read through this so that I may shed some light on my earlier rant. If you don't want to read it, don't, but if you havn't don't comment on my opinion.

See people, thing is you read a small amount of text wich was of my opinion and assume you know everything of me. You virtually quote parts of the sentense that sound incriminating while leaving out the clarification of what I'm talking about.

And this is exactly what I mean: I know that a lot of you would download the leak if you are not a beta tester. Thing is you want it and you are well aware of the risk you are taking, or mabye not aware of the risk but aware a risk is present.

I know it would spread, that's what leaks do. But once again: you left out the fact that I said most complete newbies are not beta testers, sure some of them USE wlm because a friend got invited by saying "I want that!" or perhaps not because they quite frankly (and probably) don't care about MSN. And yes they might want Plus! for their WLM when seeing it on a friends computer but wouldn't that same friend warn "It's a beta, it might screw up." As for the google search to find the leak, good! That's how I would find it. But would the noob who doesn't know shit spend his time searching "Plus! Live for Windows Live Messenger LEAK" on google? I say no. (And yes a handfull probably would, that's far from my point.)

Moving on, yes this is a community (I wont go into how it's a forum after all or compare it to a chatroom, don't worry.) And yes there are nice, smart, educated people who have a very good reason for loving Patch: He spent a lot of time and effort into making plus. Yes it's hard. But don't be an idiot, it's brilliant; optional sponsor package, Okay let's go back to the noobs who accept, and let's pretend only 3% of the people install the optional sponsor, and let's also pretend patchou makes 2$ per installation of the sponsor. (it might not work that way, don't correct me, I don't care if it works another it's probably more profitable because I'm doing a worst case scenario while staying realistic.) Now, there are "more then 6 000 000" downloads according to Mr. Something. Rounding the "more" down to 6 000 000, that's 360 000 $ US, now add the things he sells (shirts, mugs, mouse pads, whatever.) It gives more. This might be accurate or might be extreamly unaccurate, that's beside the point, point is he is not "putting money" into this he's getting some out. Much. And I'm not saying he's ripping people off his plugin is worthy of a price tag with all it's quality, but none the less.

And you think I'm jealous of him? No. I would probably not enjoy being in that position. I also am not some psychopath promoting hate, I am a logical hard headed psychopath promoting frustration over the obsessiveness this community has towards Plus!

And tell me, how would leaking "harm" Messenger Plus!? I know how! The noob installing it, not liking the fact that it crashes all the timem fucks his legit version of Windows into an unstable Linux KDE4 alpha and makes his hard-drive catch fire. But then again, that noob count's for what? 0.0001% of the users? And would probably be reconvinced to download it when the final comes out. And leaking hurts software that has a price tag, a strong reputation of reliability and utility, is depended uppon by major companies and/or small buisnesses. A leak hurts to the makers who's ideas can be stolen and reputation damaged, and to the user/company who depends on it. But Messenger Plus! is free no? Yes. Let's move on. (If I'm missing other ways leaking hurts a beta, don't tell me I don't care.)

And Patchou develops his product alone, imppressive, also something else: So what? It takes longer but he has 100% control of what get's into the product, He doesn't need a team to design all the subparts for his program (WLM/MSN does have a multitude of part's weather it's UI or the Proxy.) It's a simple plugin. (Simple mabye not because it's very good but "just a plugin": yes.)

Me. You do not fucking know me, you do not fucking think like me, you do not fucking care about what I say nor do I care about what you say, I read these posts and smile. Loosen up will you? You know I'm right and if you don't think so it's probably because your better informed then me and once again; so what? Fact remains that it's just a plugin and the people like me who love it would still like tu use it without being some bullshit official tester, without submitting the bugs, just being able tu use it no matter how many times it crashes your msn. And if it's that bad, Hey! I'll uninstall it and wait for the next leak/beta/final release/whatever.

And no I wont step out and show myself and give you my email so you can spam me with your crap and stick your plus-democratic sticks up my ass, nor am I sticking mine up yours. What I'm doing is simply giving out my opinion in an irrational, annoyingly disorganised way. If you don't like it, great, if your offended because this doesn't apply to you, ("Hey! I'm not a brainwashed idiot that worships Patchou! STOP INSULTING HIM.") Then the case is probably that I'm not talking about you but of the other people in this forum.

By the way: chances are I'm forgetting something, I don't care, I might point it out to Drag alter on for him to post it here, but untill then, happy devoteness!
Cheers.

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I'm not asking you to make public beta's that would be bad and make it seem as you don't really care and just wwant to get it out there etc etc. No that would not be good for you and would be a bad move. I'm asking people to leak it so people like me can enjoy the  buggy mess of your alpha software. That way you don't have to wash your hands and I'm happy.

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Reading this thread is really fun. Not for his (unknown guy) replies but everyone elses. OMG CRITICISM. Maybe, just maybe, if you ignored it, it would go away :----o.

OMG I can't beleive what I'm reading...!!!

I want to see Patchou's response!

This ends now, thread locked. Feel free to continue in T&T.

As for your request to the testers to leak the beta, it's your right, I jsut hope it won't happen. As I said in another post, if the beta gets leaked goes public and start being used too much, I'll block it from running (new protection in the new software). So if you get a leak I don't think it's in your interest to redistribute it.

In any case, yes, considering that this version is a major new releae, I'm pretty sure (although I don't promise anything) that I'll post a release candidate on the forum before the final 4.00 release.

PS: I didn't read the big chunk of rant, just the answer to my post.