Show invisible buddies - Printable Version

Show invisible buddies - Printable Version

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+--- Forum: Messenger Plus! for Live Messenger (/forumdisplay.php?fid=4)
+---- Forum: Scripting (/forumdisplay.php?fid=39)
+----- Thread: Show invisible buddies (/showthread.php?tid=67176)

Show invisible buddies by endsub on 10-10-2006 at 04:14 PM

Hello, can i get a script which show all invisible buddies ? thanks so much

RE: Show invisible buddies by Felu on 10-10-2006 at 04:16 PM

Sorry this is not possible as the WLM servers don't allow it and it would be invasion of privacy. And more over would you like someone to find out that you are appearing offline? No? So thats the reason.

RE: Show invisible buddies by endsub on 10-11-2006 at 01:05 PM

Ok, i understand, but there is such program in Yahoo, so i thought that could have in MLM too, what about MSN ? can i do such thing in MSN ( not ony with scripts )

RE: Show invisible buddies by Silentdragon on 10-11-2006 at 01:09 PM

No, as the server sends the same message of Appear Offline users and Offline users. It's a straight act of invasion of privacy.

RE: Show invisible buddies by NiteMare on 10-11-2006 at 01:10 PM

quote:
Originally posted by endsub
Ok, i understand, but there is such program in Yahoo, so i thought that could have in MLM too, what about MSN ? can i do such thing in MSN ( not ony with scripts )

no, based on the way the protocal and the servers are designed, there is absolutly no way to see if somebody has blocked you or is "apper offline" mode, any program claiming to do so, is ether a virus or just doesn't work

RE: Show invisible buddies by Cartox on 10-11-2006 at 02:36 PM

i use Live Notifier, when i change my dp
and i get a a notification from someone who is offline, i know that he/she is apearing offline.
it has worked several times

RE: Show invisible buddies by Jimbo on 10-11-2006 at 02:49 PM

Live notifier rarely works and just because you get a message saying that blabla has opened a conversation with you, it isn't always true. sometimes it can be a simple error happening in the script.

RE: Show invisible buddies by CookieRevised on 10-11-2006 at 11:21 PM

quote:
Originally posted by JimboDude
Live notifier rarely works and just because you get a message saying that blabla has opened a conversation with you, it isn't always true. sometimes it can be a simple error happening in the script.

Though, using session notifiers to detect packages comming from contacts who are offline is possible.

HOWEVER, and it is a BIG however!: Not all offline contacts' messengers will respond to something you do.

Note 1) "something you do": this means it is not only when you change your DP, there are many more things which could trigger such a response from a contact's messanger. Such a response can even come without you doing anything.

Note 2) "Not all": this means you can not use this trick and make the opposite conclussion. In other words: when an offline contact's messenger does not respond to such events, you can not come to the conclussion that the contact is realy offline; he/she can still be appearing offline!.

Thus as Cartox has said:

quote:
Originally posted by Cartox
i use Live Notifier, when i change my dp and i get a a notification from someone who is offline, i know that he/she is apearing offline. it has worked several times

but it also will not work on other times. And he can not know, or can't come to the conclussion, if he/she is realy offline when he doesn't get a notification.

RE: RE: Show invisible buddies by endsub on 11-12-2006 at 10:08 PM

So can i get a program which appear invisible buddies or show me who blocked me for older version of msn, i did try with status checker but it doesnt work because Microsoft had fixed this problem |-)

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 11-12-2006 at 11:30 PM

Actually, I also have the Live Notifier, and it does actually say that so and so has opened your convo window when they are online, but appear offline to you. I have tested this by going to another computer, and blocking myself, also, it has worked for people appearing offline cause i asked if they were there, and they said "yeah, how did you know" I never get notifications for people who are truely offline.

RE: Show invisible buddies by Voldemort on 11-13-2006 at 01:00 AM

quote:
Originally posted by kvnhmmd
ctually, I also have the Live Notifier, and it does actually say that so and so has opened your convo window when they are online, but appear offline to you. I have tested this by going to another computer, and blocking myself, also, it has worked for people appearing offline cause i asked if they were there, and they said "yeah, how did you know" I never get notifications for people who are truely offline.

Yeah, the thing is as cookie says that you cant conclude the opposite...

RE: Show invisible buddies by CookieRevised on 11-13-2006 at 01:56 AM

indeed

quote:
Originally posted by kvnhmmd
I never get notifications for people who are truely offline.

but you also will not get notifications for certain contacts who _are_ appearing offline.
So it's not because you don't get a notification that those people are truely offline, they still can be "appearing offline".

RE: Show invisible buddies by howthey on 11-13-2006 at 07:34 AM

One question. One time my open window notifier shows someone who is offline opened my window. Is it possible that the contact is not online at all? Like could it be possible for a contact to be really offline but it says an opened window? Or does an offline open window indicate 100% that the contact has blocked you?

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 11-13-2006 at 07:59 AM

If you got a notification that an offline person opened your window, the either they blocked you, or they are appearing offline. They are not truely offline. Next time you see that, ask them if they are there, cause if they are, they will get your message, if they have you blocked, they wont get your message.

RE: Show invisible buddies by Jimbo on 11-13-2006 at 08:04 AM

Just to clear things up, no open window or close window notifiers work. All they do is tell you when someone starts a session with you, not a window. A session could be a simple thing like clicking on your contact card, or even just clicking your name, etc.

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 11-13-2006 at 08:18 AM

Convo window closed notifiers are completely useless because what they do is detect when the link from you and your contact is closed, now, whenever you close someones convo window, it doesnt cut off the link, the link just times out if you dont send a message, or if your display picture is not refreshed, etc.

Since microsoft made the integration of contact cards in msn messenger, convo window open notifiers dont always work 100% of the time, but they do alert you every time somebody opens your window. It's just that not every alert means that they did just that, it could mean that your display picture was syncronized with their contact list.

RE: Show invisible buddies by Plan-1130 on 11-13-2006 at 09:04 AM

Well, if you don't get any response if the contact is truely offline, I smell a rebuild of block checker.
If you are desperate to find out whether someone has blocked you, you can actually find out if they blocked you, if you keep on changing dp and everything else that might trigger a response at the other contact's wlm... I mean it's like fishing, they have to bite once...
You could even track your contacts for opening a session (especially if so many things can trigger a response) and if they do respond, you know you've been a bad boy 8-)

Not that I have many people blocked me or something, in fact, everyone who blocked me i have blocked first at the moment, but sometimes people block everyone to talk to just someone, like with my PlusPrivacy script, and if that happens often it's time to think whether you realy are a good guy, just for knowing...

And it would give you a feeling like "yes, I know more than others...", which, be honoust, is what we all want, some more than others...

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 11-13-2006 at 09:29 AM

Hmmm... that would be something worth testing out, I bet you could use Display Picture Changer to constantly change your pictures, to see if any of your blocked contact's messenger picks anything up, but I'm not sure if it will work. But if the person that has blocked you has also deleted you, then im pretty sure that it wont have any affect, but you can check if they deleted you by going into WLM options--then the privacy tab, then click to view who has you added to their list.

Also, odds are, if they deleted you, they most likely have blocked you also.

OK, I did some tests, and after a countless number times changing my display picture, it hasnt popped up saying that the blocked contact opened my window

Maybe there is another way i can try to make a connection from my computer to theirs, I did notice that when i changed my display name, it changed on the blocked contacts list also, but the notifier did nothing. If i talked to the contact that had me blocked, nothing.

But once when i talked to the contact that had me blocked, the message went through! And my display picture changed on their list! How bizzare is that! There has to be some sort of loop-hole to see if someone blocked you, we just have to find it.

Also, if they have one of your display picture cached onto their computer, and you change your DP to match the ones already on their computer, your display picture will change on their list, but the notifier doesnt do anything, but if you change your display picture to a picture that their messenger dont have in its cache, it will not download the picture from your computer to theirs. But at the same time, if you have a picture that they dont have, and they open your window, the notifier will pick that up. But if you have the same picture up as they have on their list, and they open your window, nothing happens.

Also, if they opened my convo window, and the Notifier picked that up, then what kind of connection is going through, and what kind of information is it sending? This is definatly something to look into.

I performed this test by using 2 different computers, and using 2 of my MSN accounts, and blocked one of them, in case your wondering.

RE: Show invisible buddies by Plan-1130 on 11-13-2006 at 10:27 AM

What I meant actually was that you could 'blocks fishing', that is changing display picture, nickname, personal message, and do other tricks that might trigger a response, random at a certain interval (let's say 5 minutes, or 15, or 30...) and if you get any response && the contact's status is offline you get a message, but you also have an option to just track your list, on response, see if contact is offline, but change nothing.
You could then use a popup generator to change your nickname into <name>, I know ur online, and then block/unblock 1, 2 or 3 times to get that persons attention.

I know I'll be marked as a n00b or newbie for certain now, but I guess many people would like a script like this actually...

Also I've noticed if the contact has WLM he/she can talk while Appearing Offline, but also receive messages. I don't know, but maybe sending /ping, and the contact has Plus! would result in a pong?

EDIT: I sort of realise a session has to be closed in order to be reopened, and if the contact just blocked you you have to wait for the session to be closed, and so not change anything actually... That may explain why you didn't get any notifications when you blocked the other contact...

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 11-13-2006 at 10:32 AM

The ping will not result in a pong if the person is appearing offline, i tested that out

Also, the block/unblock thing with the name will not work if the person has you blocked, since messenger blocks contact signin toast for contacts that you have blocked, it would only work for people that are appearing offline

Also, when you keep changing your personal message and display name, etc, the notifier pops up saying that people have opened your window, sometimes. But not the contact that has you blocked.

RE: Show invisible buddies by Plan-1130 on 11-13-2006 at 10:43 AM

Thanks, maybe it's not that much of a good idea anyway.
Oh, and btw, do not double post, use the edit button (under your post, left of the quote, quick quote and report buttons)

RE: RE: Show invisible buddies by CookieRevised on 11-13-2006 at 11:13 AM

quote:
Originally posted by howthey
One question. One time my open window notifier shows someone who is offline opened my window. Is it possible that the contact is not online at all? Like could it be possible for a contact to be really offline but it says an opened window? Or does an offline open window indicate 100% that the contact has blocked you?

An honest question: why do you say "or has he blocked you"?

You see, it is exactly this association which need to change.

Can't it just be that he is just "Appearing Offline"?...

So, in fact your question illustrates exactly why I'm not fond of such notfiers and why I constantly stress on the fact that such things shouldn't be used, nor made. People simply don't know how to use/interpret it (even if they are willing)...

--------------

quote:
Originally posted by Plan-1130
Well, if you don't get any response if the contact is truely offline, I smell a rebuild of block checker.
If you are desperate to find out whether someone has blocked you, you can actually find out if they blocked you, if you keep on changing dp and everything else that might trigger a response at the other contact's wlm... I mean it's like fishing, they have to bite once...
You could even track your contacts for opening a session (especially if so many things can trigger a response) and if they do respond, you know you've been a bad boy

I'm sorry, but that's a completey wrong logic.

quote:
Originally posted by kvnhmmd
OK, I did some tests, and after a countless number times changing my display picture, it hasnt popped up saying that the blocked contact opened my window

stop testing....

Honestly, all this talk or even thinking you can make something, is wrong.

You even forget that there are things like a protocol which may (or may not!) send messages to Messenger and that you don't even see (regarding your "since messenger blocks toast for blocked contact, it would only work for people that are appearing offline"). You forget that there are more types of connection than the one which a "open session" sniffer detects. etc...

The only thing it will do is fuel people minds with even more (wrong) hopes and (wrong) thinking notifiers are usefull or how to use them...

quote:
Originally posted by kvnhmmd
But once when i talked to the contact that had me blocked, the message went through! And my display picture changed on their list! How bizzare is that! There has to be some sort of loop-hole to see if someone blocked you, we just have to find it.

It is not bizarre at all... Such thinking/associating like you do (with all due respect) is bizarre and inlogic.

quote:
Originally posted by Plan-1130
I know I'll be marked as a n00b or newbie for certain now, but I guess many people would like a script like this actually...

yes many people would like this because many people are fueled with hopes that such things work.

They so badly wanted it that they even believe such things work.

I'm not marking you, or any of you, as n00b or or newbie though. But there is no loophole. There are no secret hidden things. It does not work like this. Period.

(gosh... this sound seriously negative and finger pointing... sorry, didn't mean it this way, but don't know another way to say it :/)

RE: Show invisible buddies by howthey on 11-13-2006 at 06:39 PM

K well I restarted my msn and I guess my online alert thing came up. I guess the contact clicked on my alert because I changed the dp. But as I read, the contact should not display an alert if the contact blocked me right? So the contact could be appearing offline instead of blocking me?

RE: Show invisible buddies by CookieRevised on 11-13-2006 at 09:17 PM

quote:
Originally posted by howthey
K well I restarted my msn and I guess my online alert thing came up.

you guess

quote:
Originally posted by howthey
I guess the contact clicked on my alert because I changed the dp.

Guessing again. Also a contact does not need to click on anything. As I said before sessions and other things happen without interaction from the contact too (in fact they mostly happen without interaction!!). Your contact could well have been not on his PC the moment you signed on. It is mostly the messenger program itself (to update its cache of DPs for example) and the servers (to update your roaming settings for example) which react on your events.

quote:
Originally posted by howthey
But as I read, the contact should not display an alert if the contact blocked me right?

forget about what you've read though... the things posted in the above posts are incorrect assumptions, guesswork, etc. Those posts are as accurate as "I guess the contact clicked on my alert because I changed the dp". It is simply guessing and not even accurate/calculated guessing...

quote:
Originally posted by howthey
So the contact could be appearing offline instead of blocking me?

Yep, he could be appearing offline, he could be blocking you, he could be experiencing server problems, you can be experiencing server problems, etc, etc...

The only certain thing you can come up with is if a contact has an "online" status, his Messenger is indeed online, nothing more, not vice versa, not anything else.

There are no ways to check if a contact is appearing offline or blocking you or whatever. Forget about all that...

RE: Show invisible buddies by xsouldeath on 12-09-2006 at 02:27 AM

whats funny is it notifies for me for someones whose status is IDLE.. it said they opened a window with me.. how um brilliant .. sigh.

RE: Show invisible buddies by kvnhmmd on 12-09-2006 at 03:06 AM

thats because it notifies you if there is a connection between you and the person. that is why convo notifiers are not always right.