Well on a regular basis I get alerted of people taking my skins and just modifying an image or two and then trying to re-release it as their own work. It is a problem that most of the experienced skinners are getting and quite frankly it is getting annoying.

While we do normally get a good laugh at some of them, for the most part it just annoys us. We put a lot of time and effort into our work so that we may share our creations with the public and it is really frustrating to see someone just disrespect the effort we have made by just taking our work and using it without permission or crediting.

One thing skin rippers do not know is the fact that skins there were created based on another skin unauthorized will not be allowed into the skins database. So it is a waste of time for those wanting to have something in the database.

Now I do understand that skinning is quite difficult as there is no real base to work off and you have to first extract resources and make UIFiles work the way they should. In my early days there where numerous times where I wanted to give up and it was difficult to get a result that worked. But of course editing another persons skin is not the answer as you will never learn anything and could possibly be open to people starting a flame war with you.

Now I wrote the skinning guides in an attempt to squash skin ripping, but of course it is not working as well as it should. I am starting to see that the majority of skin ripping that is occurring is being done by people who know nothing about xml, css or skinning and are too afraid/lazy to try and learn it.

So I am going to work to release everyone a skin in which they can base their skin on, it will essentially be an open source skin that will contain Windows Live Messenger's graphics, but they will be restructured to make things easier for people. It will be multi-version compatible and will be less restricted in the sense that MSNRLE dependency will be non existent. On top of that I will be coding in pre-translated options to make things available to people who do not speak English.

I am hoping that in making this skin, it will help combat the rising problem in skin ripping. With the Messenger Plus! skinning contest coming soon, the last thing I want to see is thousands of skin rips entering the database.

Of course with this skin there will be restrictions, in order to use the skin you must keep the credit that appears in the skin. This credit simply thanks all those involved (myself and my translation team).

Anyway I am hoping this will lift the standard of skins and will make skin ripping non-existent.

Thoughts and comments on this are appreciated. I would like to hear input on those who would be interested in seeing this happen. Please keep in mind its going to be a long road to get this working, so please be patient.

Status updates of the project will be posted via http://designevolved.net and I will be checking both this page and the one on the design evolved forums for comments etc.

Willz

I hope this works because i too would be annoyed if someone were to take my work, change some pieces of it and name it their own. This is something that must be combated, and good on you for trying your best, i hope things work out like you want them to.

I agree with you that skin ripping should not occur, i tried to skin myself but i gave up, didn't have the time or the patience for it at the time, will possibly try again soon, i also agree with you releasing an open source skin as a new gateway for people to get into it without ripping off others

I think when you make this that it should be included with plus! or as an optional download when looking at the skinning preferences (like the skinning documentation).

This is one of the best ideas I have heard in a long time, good work

Me a victim of skin ripping

And yay, time for me to explore some new features

It's a good idea in theory but I dont think it will work.
The skin-rippers will still be too lazy to build something of their own even if they have the basis with which to do it, and the skinners who actually want to learn will be bred into a group of skinners which are dependent on this base skin to create everything and will inadvertently limit creativity and originality within the community.

maybe there could be some "mods" system that lets people modify existing skins and only distribute the differences? then the original author would be credited, people new to writing skins could have a good base to start theirs on, and if somebody didn't like a part of a skin, they could change (and even distribute the change) without modifying the original. it's win-win-win

quote:

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Originally posted by ShawnZ
maybe there could be some "mods" system that lets people modify existing skins and only distribute the differences? then the original author would be credited, people new to writing skins could have a good base to start theirs on, and if somebody didn't like a part of a skin, they could change (and even distribute the change) without modifying the original. it's win-win-win

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Good idea, but I don't know how hard it would be to implement

quote:

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Originally posted by SpunkyLoveMuff
Good idea, but I don't know how hard it would be to implement

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I quite like Shawnz' idea too
The only problem is you're essentially creating a skin of a skin which seems a bit dodgy

Also, I don't really see how this would really deter/prevent people from ripping skins, but it is a good suggestion never the less.

well if they want to rip a skin, its usually because they really like parts of it but want to change others, and this lets them do that without ripping anything

Very good idea ShawnZ. I am with you!

A mod for a skin for a add-on for a messenger huh? I don't know, not feeling that personally. I can imagine there are skinners who wouldn't like people modifying their creations, it's the opposite of what Willz is trying to achieve.

If you like to modify a skin for personal use there's nobody stopping you, and if you think your modification is really great you can contact the original creator about it. But if people were to release modifications of existing skins, how does that promote creativity and originality?

Also, by far most of the rips couldn't really be called a modification of the original skin. It's usually a completely different looking skin but based on the original skin's XML/DLL files with images from the original skin left here and there... most of the times done badly because (no offense) many of these skinners aren't sure what they're doing and haven't really read documentation. Would the original creators really like to see some random rip as a "modification" to their original work and have rippers continue to work without learning anything? Or would you rather see these rippers base their skins on a clean core where they are told why things are done a certain way and how to do skinning properly in a practival way?

I agree with MenthiX but ShawnZ has a point. His suggestion would help avoid what Volv wisely said, that this skin Willz is creating would stop new skinners from being creative based all in the same skin

I think its a great idea. mainly coz i want a skin but its all gobbledegok to me but can make graphics. I just cant believe people would think they could get away with ripping u lot off argh! If you do make this i would be so grateful x

what? Skin mods?
ok...but i disagree with this idea. Why in the world would we make it easier for lazy ppl to copy our work, rather than just blocking them from doing it?

Willz idea is pretty good, but i don't know if it is really going to work, but i think we should give it a change, who knows...
but, like basilis said, all skins would be based in one skin...and this wouldn't be really good at al.

Let's face it... skin ripping is almost a "Problem without solution", even DLLs can't stop rippers...unfortunately...
wouldn't a "Report Ripping" button in the database be better?

quote:

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Originally posted by blessedguy
wouldn't a "Report Ripping" button in the database be better?

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Hey .. HI to all

I gotta tell this to all of you guys ...
It's eating my mind,i can't keep it in me anymore .
I would be thankful if you don't ban my account,but i gotta tell that i "was" a Skin Ripper,my First CS Skin,was made by overwriting the Life of Vista's images (which is made by Ethan a.k.a Nagamasa),he knows that and he asked me to give a credit to him,which i forgot ,anyway,i have sent an e-mail  to the skins database to include him as an author ...

Hope you all will forgive me for the stupidness that i have done,and i swear that i am not making that anymore,my next skin i'm working on is completely done by ME. I ask to all of you "guys" (loooool aNILEator ) for forgiveness cause every man can make a mistake . But also can regret for the job that he has done

And,i'm not affraid not even lazy to learn how to make a skin,in fact i wanna know everything about computers even hacking

But please forgive me for the "SIN" i have made

I ASK FOR FORGIVENESS

Willz

But I don't see how such a basic skin will stop creativity as some have suggested.

In fact, I think it will increase it, since the learning curve will again be lower with the aid of this basic skin. People who want to learn skinning and want to dive into it right away can use this skin. If they can't do what they want to do with this basic skin they can easly read the documentation. And because they have a working example, it would be even easier to understand I think.

People who are bolder can start with nothing, just like it is now. And be creative all they want. Nothing is stopping them.

quote:

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Originally posted by markee
I think when you make this that it should be included with plus! or as an optional download when looking at the skinning preferences (like the skinning documentation).

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quote:

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Originally posted by blessedguy
wouldn't a "Report Ripping" button in the database be better?

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quote:

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Originally posted by MenthiX

quote:

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Originally posted by blessedguy
wouldn't a "Report Ripping" button in the database be better?

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You know where to contact me.

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People who just download skins generally wont report a skin rip or have a clue what that even means. I thought about it for a while, but figured most people will just use it for requesting support, asking how to install skins, and any other purpose except reporting an actual rip or problem. The people who are the experts on this, you guys as skinners, know where to contact me, and other people who really care will find their way to the forum or contact the original creator directly.

Thanks for the suggestion though, i didn't mean to burn it down.

quote:

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Originally posted by MenthiX
People who just download skins generally wont report a skin rip or have a clue what that even means. I thought about it for a while, but figured most people will just use it for requesting support, asking how to install skins, and any other purpose except reporting an actual rip or problem. The people who are the experts on this, you guys as skinners, know where to contact me, and other people who really care will find their way to the forum or contact the original creator directly.

Thanks for the suggestion though, i didn't mean to burn it down.

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quote:

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Originally posted by ResourcE
I ask to all of you gays for forgiveness

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quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised

In fact, I think it will increase it, since the learning curve will again be lower with the aid of this basic skin. People who want to learn skinning and want to dive into it right away can use this skin. If they can't do what they want to do with this basic skin they can easly read the documentation. And because they have a working example, it would be even easier to understand I think.

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quote:

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Originally posted by MenthiX
I can imagine there are skinners who wouldn't like people modifying their creations, it's the opposite of what Willz is trying to achieve. /quote]

Yeah I totally do not like this "skin mod" idea because If we do allow mods it will simply open the door to people just adding in a crappy image that does not suit our skins into the skin and then releasing it. Menthix has several examples of these mods gone horribly wrong, I'm sure he'd be glad to show you some

If the mod idea were to be implemented I'd simply quit skinning, remove my skins and call it a day

Like Ev0, Iron Man and Zero-G are my own homegrown designs (Zero-G was with mk as well but yeah) and I spent a lot of time and effort to get it that polished. Its like my own work of art sort of and I really want it to stay the way I made it. Its sort of like saying "hey I don't like the mona lisa, how about you let me paint something on top of it to what I think is better "

Ok maybe not that extreme but you get the idea. The point of this skin is to get people who do not know xml and css to be able to create skins easily without having to resort to editing other skins.

To people complaining that it will restrict creativity...... I'm sorry but thats a load of crap. Editing a skin an existing skin with just a single image replace is way more uncreative than editing a skin based on the original WLM. People who don't know css and xml will always go the easiest way out, nothing will change that but at least I can make it so they leave other peoples work alone.

The people who are interested in skinning will expand on what this skin has and will most likely not stick to what I have put down. It's not as if theres a lock on the skin that goes "I'm sorry but you can't add anything else you must stick to what I have put here kthxbai"

One thing I see this skin being used for is its precoded options, people can start a skin without having to worry to code in settings (unless theres some special ones they want). It saves people time and skins can be released more frequent.

There is only one way to hide a button in WLM..... so I don't think people can be much more creative with that . I've gotten lots of positive feedback as it is already so I know I'm on the right track. I do agree with cookierevised, this should not be included with Plus because as he said not everyone will skin.

lol and Nile you know the saying if you cant beat em join em

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quote:

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Originally posted by Willz
lol and Nile (Smilie) you know the saying if you cant beat em join em (Smilie)

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I agree with Willz & aNILEator and LOL,i made a mistake ,instead of typing "guys ive typed "gays" looooooool

And,aNILEator,you need to know that i will always support you,and will support anyone that will help people understand the skinning better,no matter is he Willz or aNILEator or Basilis or someone else.

But,i ask you Willz and aNILEator :

DO NOT RELEASE that template !!!(or what is it ) for making skins easily . Its not interesting then ,you just replace the images ... and DONE

The fun is when you do all from the beginning ,the testing ,the work,the hours past in front of the PC ,the search throughout "style" and "definition" files , and of course ,the most interessting :

"The crashing of WLM when you did something wrong"

I know all of these cause , I "was" a Skin Ripper,which I'm not know ,and i know what is to do your skin from the beginning and to do it just with replacing images

My next skin which is well .. almost done,it's made just by me with no skin ripping

Hmm somehow I don't think this will stop people from skin ripping - however it may stop a few. I myself might be guilty of "skin ripping" - if I'm using a skin I like but there are several resources which I find a bit dodgy I may go to the effort to remove those resources and go with the messenger default, but I in no way shape or form "release" the skin, in fact I don't even package it again for my own installation later on (which would probably be a good idea).

Anyway, I agree that if it's a ripped skin, don't accept it into the database. But if that's not enough, create some sort of watermark in the skin which can't be removed as to preserve the integrity of the original creator, and perhaps if the skin has been tampered with the watermark will state it has been so. That's probably not very feasible but I still think it's worth mentioning.

I have an IDEA !!!

If we can only make somehow the
<Name>xxxxx</Name>
  <Description>yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy<Description>
    <AboutUrl>http://zzzzzzzzzzzz</AboutUrl>

non-changeable,then,the ripping would be stopped about 90% and the name of the author will be still there so the ripper can't release it

Yeah advanced watermarks..... don't think its going to happen its like technically impossible with what we have.

I think people are expecting that I will be releasing a skin where all to work has been done. Its not really like that, all I am doing is keeping the WLM default look but removing the dependency on MSNRLE and adding in simple things which most people know how to do with ease already.

If people are thinking that its going to be like advanced with things you see in Zero-G or WAM well I'm sorry to burst your bubble but its not going to be like that.

For people to do something unique they will still have to work for it. The default WLM look is all the skin will be with things edited to be in a more meaningful way (e.g one window border that is used in every window rather than two).

Like I've said before, this will be aimed at those who don't know css and xml and don't want to learn. It is mainly those people who rip. If experienced skinners don't want to use it its their choice, nobody is forcing them to use it.

quote:

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Originally posted by ResourcE
I have an IDEA !!!

If we can only make somehow the
<Name>xxxxx</Name>
  <Description>yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy<Description>
    <AboutUrl>http://zzzzzzzzzzzz</AboutUrl>

non-changeable,then,the ripping would be stopped about 90% and the name of the author will be still there so the ripper can't release it

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quote:

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Originally posted by ResourcE
I have an IDEA !!!

If we can only make somehow the
<Name>xxxxx</Name>
  <Description>yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy<Description>
    <AboutUrl>http://zzzzzzzzzzzz</AboutUrl>

non-changeable,then,the ripping would be stopped about 90% and the name of the author will be still there so the ripper can't release it

---

What does indeed lead us to what Willz suggested before, that is, have skins compiled into a closed-source, non-disassemblable plsk file (using some sort of Skin compiler), and have Plus! run the skin directly from this file.

Or,if we can make somehow when we end the skin,to make the .xml file  un-openable,and save a copy of it into our hard drive for the upcoming updates

See I don't agree with that because by looking at the skininfo.xml file you can actually learn how to skin yourself, they are a valuable resource to novice and developing skinners.

quote:

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Originally posted by Aardvark
See I don't agree with that because by looking at the skininfo.xml file you can actually learn how to skin yourself, they are a valuable resource to novice and developing skinners.

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well in microsoft office you can set a read only password on your files so people can view them but cannot save the changes they make, so maybe plus can do something along those lines

They cannot save but they can copy to another file. So simple as that. It is difficult to stop skin ripping. Only if Plus could implement a password in the .xml so that only the creator and everyone else having taken permission from him would be able to open it. That is my suggestion

quote:

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Originally posted by Aardvark

quote:

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Originally posted by ResourcE


If watermarks are impossible with what we have, what if the skinning engine was updated to provide these watermarks on the files - then again would it really be worth it? And how visible would these watermarks be. I personally Don't want the words "Willz - designevolved.net" written all over my conversations. It would be some good advertising though!

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Watermarks just annoy the hell out of me I would never resort to that even if it was implemented. It's just like DLL's, if I wanted to protect my work a bit better I would use dll's but yeah it defeats the purpose of plus skinning imo.

Ripping isn't looking at skininfo code. Look if people are stuck on how to structure an xml (e.g how to declare shaped regions) then its fine to look at another persons xml as long as all you are doing is just seeing how its done and then making your own code to suit whatever you are making.

I consider someone to have ripped when they just modify a couple of images and try to release it as their own work. If you can still see the core of the original skin then it is ripping (in graphics terms).

In coding terms, if you just take another skins UIFiles without asking first then that is ripping (unless of course its like minor things like button removal which in that case who really cares )

I have suggested in adopting the winamp style of skin files where the contents of the skin package are not extracted, but of course to see that happen we will probably have to wait till the next version of Plus.

@Resource, I don't think its technically possible to lock out an xml file so nobody can edit it.

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quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett
well in microsoft office you can set a read only password on your files so people can view them but cannot save the changes they make, so maybe plus can do something along those lines

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Hmm well if someone did want to go to that much effort to edit a skin yes it is possible

I just don't think Patchou will want to spend the effort in adding in advanced content protection systems in just for skins. I'm sure he'd rather spend his energy trying to figure out better things.

I am just hopeful that what I will do will help the situation. I know it won't totally stop it, I'm not a fool.

So here is my goal:

Get Windows Live Messenger to a state where it was like in MSN Messenger 7.5. Where all main images were pngs, no MSNRLEs, no vista only images, no 4006 group dependency.

I will simplify changing text colors by making it controlled via skininfo so that you don't have to open multiple files to edit the one thing. The same goes for the min max and close buttons.

If people don't want that, well too bad I'm doing it because it benefits me to get something that efficient going as well, not just newbies and other skinners.

quote:

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Originally posted by Volv
I quite like Shawnz' idea too
The only problem is you're essentially creating a skin of a skin which seems a bit dodgy

Also, I don't really see how this would really deter/prevent people from ripping skins, but it is a good suggestion never the less.

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quote:

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Originally posted by John Anderton

quote:

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Originally posted by Volv
I quite like Shawnz' idea too
The only problem is you're essentially creating a skin of a skin which seems a bit dodgy

Also, I don't really see how this would really deter/prevent people from ripping skins, but it is a good suggestion never the less.

---

You make a skin X. I make a mod called X.mod
X has a.jpg; I mod it to a.mod.jpg

Now my mod installer has a replacement for a.jpg from X and nothing else so Plus! will start first load my mod's replacement file list, then start loading skin X till it reaches a file that's on my list. Once it does so, it loads my file instead of yours into memory and voila

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I posted it above but no one saw it cause me, willz and Aardvark posted on the same time. Anyway, what if Plus! could let the creator insert a code in the .xml. Doing so, only the creator and people who got permission from him would be able to open it. Thoughts?

quote:

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Originally posted by Basilis
I posted it above but no one saw it cause me, willz and Aardvark posted on the same time. Anyway, what if Plus! could let the creator insert a code in the .xml. Doing so, only the creator and people who got permission from him would be able to open it. Thoughts?

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you know a lot of what has been discussed above is primarily focus on prevention of the problem occuring in the future, while thats good and all and goes part way to solving the issue if a skin ripper is determined to rip what is really going to stop them, perhaps what we need is harsher sentences for those who are caught ripping, is just not letting it into the database enough?

for example if a skinner is caught ripping from another skin then issue them a fine, money collected from the fines then goes to patchou to help pay for things like the site and stuff this could mean patchou getting as much money out of fines for skin ripping as he gets out of the sponsor, if people are fined for ripping then its a bit more of an effective deterant than just saying you cant have it listed in the database.

quote:

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Originally posted by Volv

quote:

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Originally posted by John Anderton

quote:

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Originally posted by Volv
I quite like Shawnz' idea too
The only problem is you're essentially creating a skin of a skin which seems a bit dodgy

Also, I don't really see how this would really deter/prevent people from ripping skins, but it is a good suggestion never the less.

---

You make a skin X. I make a mod called X.mod
X has a.jpg; I mod it to a.mod.jpg

Now my mod installer has a replacement for a.jpg from X and nothing else so Plus! will start first load my mod's replacement file list, then start loading skin X till it reaches a file that's on my list. Once it does so, it loads my file instead of yours into memory and voila

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Don't see how that's relevant to my post whatsoever, but okay

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quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett

for example if a skinner is caught ripping from another skin then issue them a fine, money collected from the fines then goes to patchou to help pay for things like the site and stuff this could mean patchou getting as much money out of fines for skin ripping as he gets out of the sponsor, if people are fined for ripping then its a bit more of an effective deterant than just saying you cant have it listed in the database.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Willz
Although I sorta wanted to hear like what people wanted to see done in the skin but oh well this is good too

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quote:

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Originally posted by Volv

quote:

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Originally posted by Willz
Although I sorta wanted to hear like what people wanted to see done in the skin but oh well this is good too

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lol
Well then, I think most importantly you should ensure that the 'basic skin' places minimal limitations on creativity - skinners using this skin should be able to do everything they currently can without being guided down any specific design paths because I think the last thing we want is 500 identical and generic skins with a couple of different pics and text colours separating them

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errmmm...
Have you ever seen that using the "Read Only" or "Hidden" atribute at the file propierties won't allow the resources to be seen? (except for when the person already knows that, knows how to turn Hidden files to visible)

I'm not saying that you shouldn't do it, if you can it would probably be great. I'm just finding it a bit difficult to imagine what the product will be like

Okay, another suggestion which you may have (and probably have) already thought of is extensive comments in UIFILEs (such as a description of what the current UIFILE is for at the top, what each element corresponds to in WLM, etc.) so that users can easily track down what they're looking for.

quote:

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Originally posted by Volv
I'm not saying that you shouldn't do it, if you can it would probably be great. I'm just finding it a bit difficult to imagine what the product will be like

Okay, another suggestion which you may have (and probably have) already thought of is extensive comments in UIFILEs (such as a description of what the current UIFILE is for at the top, what each element corresponds to in WLM, etc.) so that users can easily track down what they're looking for.

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if you really want to be a nazi you could sign every file going into the script database with a special private key, and embed a public key into messenger

for debugging, everyone could have their own public key also embedded into messenger, so they could run their own skins on their own computer without submitting it to the scripts DB.

but, don't use that idea. it's stupid.

This might sound absurd, but how about releasing the skins into the public domain or with very relaxed licensing (Creative Commons). Think freedom, think software libre.

The license people use to release their skins is up to the individual skin creator.

quote:

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Originally posted by mezzanine
This might sound absurd, but how about releasing the skins into the public domain or with very relaxed licensing (Creative Commons). Think freedom, think software libre.

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quote:

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Originally posted by MenthiX
The license people use to release their skins is up to the individual skin creator.

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What if rules were explicitly stated in the skinning how-to's as well as in the instructions of how to upload your skin? You can't say they wern't warned.

quote:

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Originally posted by Willz
Well on a regular basis I get alerted of people taking my skins and just modifying an image or two and then trying to re-release it as their own work. It is a problem that most of the experienced skinners are getting and quite frankly it is getting annoying.

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Well, this is the problem with scripts/skins being "open-source".

Maybe the script/skinning engine should be rethought to allow open and close source scripts/skins. This would make, for example, TB write another Stuffplug script for Plus!

quote:

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Originally posted by riahc4
Well, this is the problem with scripts/skins being "open-source".

Maybe the skinning engine should be rethought to allow open and close source scripts. This would make TB write another Stuffplug script for Plus!

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quote:

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Originally posted by riahc4
Well, this is the problem with scripts/skins being "open-source".

Maybe the script/skinning engine should be rethought to allow open and close source scripts/skins. This would make, for example, TB write another Stuffplug script for Plus!

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Completely agree. It is the only way for some people wanting to skin to learn how. Of course they shouldn't steal resources but just see the way thing work.

quote:

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Originally posted by Basilis
Completely agree. It is the only way for some people wanting to skin to learn how. Of course they shouldn't steal resources but just see the way thing work.

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quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett

quote:

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Originally posted by Basilis
Completely agree. It is the only way for some people wanting to skin to learn how. Of course they shouldn't steal resources but just see the way thing work.

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yes i agree they shouldnt steal resources but closing the source to stop them from doing it is in my opinion a bit too extreme, i truely beleive that with open live and through providing other easy to following educational resources that we can reach them and convert them to good respectful skinners.

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true, but hope of one day acheiving paradise is the driving force that we so badly need, maybe its a scary place now but if we lose hope of ever acheiving paradise then the very fabric of all society itself will crumble.

quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett
true, but hope of one day acheiving paradise is the driving force that we so badly need, maybe its a scary place now but if we lose hope of ever acheiving paradise then the very fabric of all society itself will crumble.

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quote:

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Originally posted by blessedguy

quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett
true, but hope of one day acheiving paradise is the driving force that we so badly need, maybe its a scary place now but if we lose hope of ever acheiving paradise then the very fabric of all society itself will crumble.

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Maybe...
but don't think that one pre-made skin (a great job, willz! tested it, and works nice) will make 'em stop... maybe they will just slow down a bit

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quote:

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Originally posted by stuartbennett
perhaps it wont stop it completely but it is a good first step, if you do enough things to slow something down eventually it stops so while it doesnt solve the problem  entirely its a good first step wouldnt you agree.

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Sharing is caring!

Well i was thinking (PS, i havent read any of the posts just incase someone HAS said this....)

I was pondering on making a Open Source Newb Guide. Willz guide is good to become a proper skinner. But what the Newb Guide would do, is help people with there problems. For example, you would have a single post linking to all the other Newb Guide posts. And each other post, will have a title like "Newb Guide - How to add a background in a conversation window" or "Newb Guide - How to change slider"

You know that sort of thing, a bit more specfic sort of guide.

The reason someone rips is there lost, its to much for them, they get someone elses skin and just change an image here and there and thats it. By having a more specfic guide, they can slowly work there way up. So just say, someone is looking at there messenger and thinking "Damn, wouldnt be awesome if there was a giant flying pig in this background". There not going to look through tones of Documentation, there just going to rip someones skin and change the image. Although the Open Source skin DOES solve this (or at LEAST partially). I still think we should have a newb guide. .


I was going to start it up, but I dont know anywhere near enough about skinning, all i can do is change images . And add an option or two in. I cant do many of the UIfile stuff..... So yeah, just thought id get the idea out there and hopefully someone else can give it a go


EDIT(I read the last couple of posts): I know what phaze two is.... its where Willz shows us his secret to his skins. His genuise rooster!!!! His just the guy who feeds it. Otherwsie the Rooster does all these posts and coding and imaging! Willz is just there for the mug shots .

And dont try and Deny it willz, i know its true!!!

i like the skin mod idea, and i think there should be a bit of collaboration between designers instead of plagiarism but hopefully less of this will occur with the release of open live, i would like to be able to change skins though even though i'd never release anything just to remove stuff and move things around

an open source skin idea is more professional, if some one don't know any thing about designing languages but they wanna edit the skin on how artist they are ... this is going 2 be very easy and the skin will be 100% right and the skins in plus will be very popular thing .

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Originally posted by Nuna
an open source skin idea is more professional, if some one don't know any thing about designing languages but they wanna edit the skin on how artist they are ... this is going 2 be very easy and the skin will be 100% right and the skins in plus will be very popular thing .

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