[Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in - Printable Version
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[Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by riahc4 on 08-11-2008 at 01:50 PM
It would be nice that anywhere in the world that we sign in with a computer that has Messenger and Plus! installed, it gets all our personal settings (Chat logs on/off*, fonts, allow pings, etc)
* - This (and others) could be a setting that DOESN'T get imported seeing as most of us like our chat logs on our PCs only.
As a alternative, maybe a script could do this.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Dempsey on 08-12-2008 at 08:52 AM
quote:I think that would be the better option as if it was in Plus! itself then people would assume they could store it on Patchou's server's but if a script does it then people would use their own ftp server or whatever, but I like the idea
Originally posted by riahc4
As a alternative, maybe a script could do this.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by RaceProUK on 08-13-2008 at 09:13 PM
quote:Or they'd expect to use the script writer's server.
Originally posted by Dempsey
if a script does it then people would use their own ftp server or whatever
It wouldn't surprise me if most Foxmarks users use the Fomarks server instead of their own.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by prashker on 08-13-2008 at 09:45 PM
quote:Yeah, I'd love for it to go to my sonicsam.net, that way I wouldn't have to forget to export my settings everytime I format
Originally posted by Dempsey
quote:I think that would be the better option as if it was in Plus! itself then people would assume they could store it on Patchou's server's but if a script does it then people would use their own ftp server or whatever, but I like the idea
Originally posted by riahc4
As a alternative, maybe a script could do this.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by mynetx on 08-14-2008 at 04:42 PM
Well, this remembers me a bit of the function that is built into the Music Now Playing script. Uhmm, can anyone list the sections that would have to be backed up? (Like, reg paths, files, etc).
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by RaceProUK on 08-14-2008 at 05:16 PM
Just the registry keys would need backing up, unless you wanted to include scripts and skins.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by riahc4 on 08-22-2008 at 10:33 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Dempsey
...as if it was in Plus! itself then people would assume they could store it on Patchou's server's...
Which is the point.
Plus! and its users already use a Patchou server for sounds.
This feature could be problably used on the same server as its just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Jesus on 08-22-2008 at 11:29 AM
quote:few kbs * few million users = few GBs of extra load on the server.
Originally posted by riahc4
just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Menthix on 08-22-2008 at 11:52 AM
quote:... *50000000+, every time they sign in?
Originally posted by riahc4
could be problably used on the same server as its just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings
The sound server isn't really one machine either. It's at least 4 servers with multiple CPUs and over 16GB of RAM each. Those are stats from over a few years ago, i would imagine it's more now. Let's say the average settings file is around 10kb, which isn't much when you consider all the contact-specific settings Plus! stores. 10kb * 50M is already close to half a TB. A lot of people will signing multiple times per day, and the group of active Plus! users is still growing. Bandwidth for this feature alone could easily be over 1TB per day.
I'm not saying it isn't doable for Plus! to offer a feature like this natively, but it does take massive resources (which need to be paid). A lot of things need to be considered: How much server resources and bandwidth would be needed? Is the feature worth the resources/cost? How do we insure people's private information is safe (emailadresses/passwords)?
We went trough the same kind of things with auto-update for skins & scripts, which is why it took so long from the first idea to the release.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by riahc4 on 08-24-2008 at 10:34 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Jesus
quote:few kbs * few million users = few GBs of extra load on the server.
Originally posted by riahc4
just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings.
quote:
Originally posted by MenthiX
quote:... *50000000+, every time they sign in?
Originally posted by riahc4
could be problably used on the same server as its just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings
The sound server isn't really one machine either. It's at least 4 servers with multiple CPUs and over 16GB of RAM each. Those are stats from over a few years ago, i would imagine it's more now. Let's say the average settings file is around 10kb, which isn't much when you consider all the contact-specific settings Plus! stores. 10kb * 50M is already close to half a TB. A lot of people will signing multiple times per day, and the group of active Plus! users is still growing. Bandwidth for this feature alone could easily be over 1TB per day.
I'm not saying it isn't doable for Plus! to offer a feature like this natively, but it does take massive resources (which need to be paid). A lot of things need to be considered: How much server resources and bandwidth would be needed? Is the feature worth the resources/cost? How do we insure people's private information is safe (emailadresses/passwords)?
We went trough the same kind of things with auto-update for skins & scripts, which is why it took so long from the first idea to the release.
Custom sounds were a new thing which I doubt anyone (or very few people compared to this Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere feature) now uses.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by CookieRevised on 08-24-2008 at 11:09 PM
quote:I very much doubt it. Or it would be very hard to do it in a proper way anyways.
Originally posted by riahc4
As a alternative, maybe a script could do this.
Simple reason realy: a script runs in the exact same environment which you're trying to change with your settings. So that is asking for trouble and/or not-working.
If you want to do this with some 3rd party tool/addon/script you need to do it outside of the Plus! sandbox, _before_ Plus! gets loaded.
quote:The stats say otherwise.
Originally posted by riahc4
Custom sounds were a new thing which I doubt anyone (or very few people compared to this Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere feature) now uses.
But even so, let's say it is used less now than it was back then.
The custom sounds are now using multiple servers and account for a LOT of traffic. So assuming (well, it is almost a logic fact) that the roaming settings will be used far more and way more frequent (upon each sign in) than custom sounds, it actually contradicts what you just meant/said... And it means that there need to be a lot of servers, way more than for the custom sounds, just like Menthix explained.
It is doable, and has been suggested/requested before, but as Menthix and others explained: it would generate a hell of a lot of traffic. Which needs to be taken in serious considerarion, just as many other (security) aspects. It isn't easy at all, shouldn't be taken for granted, and it might not be 'worth the money' so to speak.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Jesus on 08-24-2008 at 11:17 PM
quote:Well, I doubt there's either server bandwidth or a budget for it, but if there is, maybe it will be implemented some day.
Originally posted by riahc4
Custom sounds were a new thing which I doubt anyone (or very few people compared to this Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere feature) now uses.
I wasn't saying I don't like the idea, I was just trying to point out that you seem to underestimate certain things. Not just the "few kbs" which amount to a huge amount of data if lots of users use the feature, but now again the "very few people" using the custom sounds feature. Why would a feature that is used by so few require 4 servers with the specs MenthiX talked about? If the feature wasn't worth the resources (both financial and in terms of hardware), my guess would be that it would have been taken out already.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by riahc4 on 08-24-2008 at 11:53 PM
Well I sorta see your point.
A 8.98 KB config while made up of a 90 char line multiplied 100 times in a row would generate a traffic 876953.125 MB which no server could handle at a time (I took this by multipliying 50 million by 2)
A alternative is that as you may know there is a new feature in WLM called "Keep Me Signed In". It asks you for a location. If the selected location is available and online, it transfers the settings from THAT computer to the computer you just signed on (No cost at all on Plus!/Patchou's side and would just cost the bandwidth on the clients side)
Thats a pretty good and similar alternative 
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Nathan on 08-24-2008 at 11:57 PM
Also no one is pointing out the fact that the custom sounds feature is spread across 4 servers with huge specs, and not _everyone_ uses custom sounds. This would be a feature that would be used on everylogin from every person with plus. And that in turn would equal much more than the sounds data.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Menthix on 08-24-2008 at 11:58 PM
quote:Pretty creative idea. I kinda like it, but sounds more like something suited for a script.
Originally posted by riahc4
feature in WLM called "Keep Me Signed In". It asks you for a location. If the selected location is available and online, it transfers the settings from THAT computer to the computer you just signed on
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by CookieRevised on 08-25-2008 at 12:51 AM
quote:
Already pointed out by Menthix, Jesus and me though.
Originally posted by Nathan
Also no one is pointing out the fact that the custom sounds feature is spread across 4 servers with huge specs, and not _everyone_ uses custom sounds.
(yeah I know, I said I was going to sleep, sorry. But I thought of something I needed to rectify asap in some other post. And one thing lead to the other, etc... why don't I PM this? blah, who knows nn)
quote:That would indeed be a nice alternative.
Originally posted by riahc4
A alternative is that as you may know there is a new feature in WLM called "Keep Me Signed In". It asks you for a location. If the selected location is available and online, it transfers the settings from THAT computer to the computer you just signed on (No cost at all on Plus!/Patchou's side and would just cost the bandwidth on the clients side)
But if this is made as a script, you might as well make a script which simply uses your own server or FTP location to store all of the settings. Thus, no need for the MPOP feature of WLM9 and thus compatible with any WLM version.
Even so, the same limits apply as I said earlier, a script can't do this properly, using MPOP or not (unless you want to restart Messenger each time after you signed in for the first time).
Even for a Plus! feature this would be hard to do, since there are settings which requires Plus! (and thus Messenger) to be restarted.
So, in practice, I don't see something like this happening anytime soon (unfortunatly, as it is a nice idea). That is in a proper way, which takes all the settings, and without the need for a restart after signing in. Unless there are some radical changes made in how Plus! loads and loads its settings.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Nathan on 08-25-2008 at 12:56 AM
Oops, it seems my speed reading isn't up to scratch
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Dex Luther on 08-25-2008 at 06:01 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MenthiX
quote:... *50000000+, every time they sign in?
Originally posted by riahc4
could be problably used on the same server as its just a few kbs of data when we load/save our settings
Doesn't have to be set to load each time a person signs in. When a person signs into a new place with plus installed they could go into the preferences menu (or on the welcome box thingy) and click an "Import from WWW" button.
It would only need to be done once. After that the settings are stored on the computer.
The only exception would be people using public computers that erase any saved data stored on them when the user logs off (Library internet stations). Other than that I don't know very many people that log in from a different new computer every time they get on.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by CookieRevised on 08-25-2008 at 06:22 AM
If it is just for 1 time, then what is the point of the feature? In that case you could simple export/import your settings using a USB stick or whatever. imho.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Basilis on 08-25-2008 at 08:24 AM
quote:And I think that is the reason Patchou gave us the ability to import/export our Preferences. To be able to get them anywhere we need. If it was easy to take our settings everywhere we sign in, I am sure Patchou would have done it.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
If it is just for 1 time, then what is the point of the feature? In that case you could simple export/import your settings using a USB stick or whatever. imho.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by djdannyp on 08-25-2008 at 09:37 AM
What if it was implemented but was conditional on us having our own webspace to host the file?
A lot of people here have their own websites and I'm sure there's plenty of free hosting sites where we could store our own file.
That way it would remove the privacy issue as it would be in our own hands, as far as we would only be using a host we trusted and it would mean that Patchou wouldn't need dedicated servers for hosting all the information.
It would also give us the opportunity to use a network folder (or something similar) to store and access our settings easily if we just use Plus! on two different computers on the same network (as I do with my PC and Laptop)
Just a thought
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by riahc4 on 08-25-2008 at 12:05 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:Already pointed out by Menthix, Jesus and me though.
Originally posted by Nathan
Also no one is pointing out the fact that the custom sounds feature is spread across 4 servers with huge specs, and not _everyone_ uses custom sounds.
(yeah I know, I said I was going to sleep, sorry. But I thought of something I needed to rectify asap in some other post. And one thing lead to the other, etc... why don't I PM this? blah, who knows
quote:That would indeed be a nice alternative.
Originally posted by riahc4
A alternative is that as you may know there is a new feature in WLM called "Keep Me Signed In". It asks you for a location. If the selected location is available and online, it transfers the settings from THAT computer to the computer you just signed on (No cost at all on Plus!/Patchou's side and would just cost the bandwidth on the clients side)
But if this is made as a script, you might as well make a script which simply uses your own server or FTP location to store all of the settings.
The problem is that "common users" don't have a server or a FTP location. Also, if done with a script, this means that other users which simply download Plus! wont get this feature.
And yup I agree with this being a Windows Live Messenger 9 feature only (once it is fully out of beta) and using the "Keep Me Signed In" feature. This way:
1: Each account has a location associated with it thus no privacy concerns.
2: It can do a P2P transfer of the settings.
RE: RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Dex Luther on 08-25-2008 at 04:41 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
If it is just for 1 time, then what is the point of the feature? In that case you could simple export/import your settings using a USB stick or whatever. imho.
Do you import your settings every time you log in on your computer?
I don't see the point in having it import your settings every time you log it. It just seems like an unnecessary load/hassle.
It would be handy as a first log in thing though as not everyone carries around a USB stick 24/7, and the version saved in an email to one self might not be the most up-to-date one.
RE: RE: RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Vilkku on 08-25-2008 at 04:56 PM
quote:Well, if the point is to sync settings you would have to at least be able to choose when and how frequently it syncs. Wouldn't need to download the settings every time, just check the settings file on the server and see if it is the same or newer than the one stored.
Originally posted by Dex Luther
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
If it is just for 1 time, then what is the point of the feature? In that case you could simple export/import your settings using a USB stick or whatever. imho.
Do you import your settings every time you log in on your computer?
I don't see the point in having it import your settings every time you log it. It just seems like an unnecessary load/hassle.
It would be handy as a first log in thing though as not everyone carries around a USB stick 24/7, and the version saved in an email to one self might not be the most up-to-date one.
I would definitely use this feature/script, if one would ever be made.
RE: RE: RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by CookieRevised on 08-25-2008 at 07:19 PM
quote:You're contradicting yourself...
Originally posted by Dex Luther
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
If it is just for 1 time, then what is the point of the feature? In that case you could simple export/import your settings using a USB stick or whatever. imho.
Do you import your settings every time you log in on your computer?
I don't see the point in having it import your settings every time you log it. It just seems like an unnecessary load/hassle.
It would be handy as a first log in thing though as not everyone carries around a USB stick 24/7, and the version saved in an email to one self might not be the most up-to-date one.
The point I was making is that if you're only going to import settings once, then what is the point of having the ability to do it from a network drive or from the cloud?
As for not being able to carry an USB stick 24/7: That is exactly it. You _wont_ need to carry the USB stick _24/7_ since, as you said so yourself, you only import your settings _once_ and be done with. Thus that is carrying an USB stick to your other machine _once_...
Hence, I repeat my question: what is the point of making a full blown networked feature when people are only going to use it once anyways?
The biggest benefit of having a remote location to store your settings is exactly that you don't need to carry an USB stick 24/7 anymore when you're changing settings _all the time_ on different machines. So, when you say you are _not_ going to change settings all the time and you would only import them _once_, then there is not much point for such a remote location either as it wouln't be used a lot.
---
Note: I'm not against such a feature, I would use it since I have multiple PCs. But don't contradict yourselfs when you reply saying that you normally only import settings _once_, and then suggesting that it would be a handy feature assuming you _regulary_ need to import/sync settings.
Again, if you only import settings _once_ then there is no need for such a feature because you might as well just use an USB stick _once_ in that case.
Anyways, not possible with a script anyways. And even with the feature build in Plus! itself, you still would need to restart Messenger each time. Thus not very convenient and thus not worth the hassle if you're going to use that feature on a regular basis. And if you're not going to use that feature on a regular basis, I doubt Patchou will add it...
Anyways, making something like this as a very small but seperate Windows script/program would be perfectly possible though. And I think that would be the way to go for such a feature.
RE: [Suggestion] Plus!/Messenger settings anywhere we sign in by Vilkku on 08-25-2008 at 07:47 PM
Maybe, if made into a script that uses your own server, it could sync logs and even transferred files as well?