This will convince you? - Printable Version
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This will convince you? by Le@ndro on 08-25-2008 at 11:27 PM
I know you are tired of threads like this. But read all, please.
In the Microsoft Adversingment site says that are 37 milions of Windows Live Messenger users in Brasil( http://advertising.microsoft.com/brasil/windows-l...ndowsLiveMessenger ). This is 3,36 times the population of Portugal. But you can say: and the others contry? In the Wikipedia say there are 215 milions of native portuguese speaks( http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingua_portuguesa ). If we deduct the population of Brazil(190 milions), rest 25 milions of peoples.
So, the number of Windows Live Messenger users in Brazil is more than the portuguese speakers outside Brazil.
Do I convice you?
RE: This will convince you? by Lou on 08-26-2008 at 12:01 AM
What's your point?
RE: This will convince you? by Menthix on 08-26-2008 at 12:02 AM
Uhm, so what are you trying to say?
Isn't the official language for both Brazil and Portugal Portuguese, and already included in the current Plus! setup?
RE: This will convince you? by MeEtc on 08-26-2008 at 12:03 AM
probably this:
http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=83500
RE: This will convince you? by Menthix on 08-26-2008 at 12:10 AM
Oh i see. Well yeah, maybe it should be considered.
Microsoft has different translation variations for only 2 languages: Chinese and Portuguese. Plus! has variations for Chinese, but not for Portuguese. He has a point.
I understand some of the Plus! translations were merged, and the probably should be in most variations. But, if Microsoft makes an exception for Portuguese, Plus! should at least consider it too.
RE: This will convince you? by Le@ndro on 08-26-2008 at 02:52 PM
It's this MenthiX.
And have more: There are a brazilian version of MSN since 1999, the portuguese version started last year. Google has 2 offices in Brazil, 0 in Portugal. Yahoo! has a office in Brazil and don't have a portuguese site, only brazilian. When Napoleão decide invade Portugal, the royal family of Portugal came to Brazil, 100 years ago.
I want to show you the importance of Brazil actually. We aren't a underdeveloped contry anymore, we are going to be a world potence, probably the second biggest potence.
In Brazil, the people download Live Messenger and after download Plus! It's difficult see a computer with Live Messenger but without Plus! Yesterday I search for those informations and did this post, showing the importance of Brazil in the language.
If Microsoft did the exception, why Patchou cant't do. Please Patchou!
ps.: What was the defalt homepage of Internet Explore in Portugal before the MSM Portugal?
RE: This will convince you? by davidm_silva on 08-27-2008 at 12:05 AM
The default homepage in IE was MSN.com. Since IE7, the default page is pt.msn.com.
Best regards,
davidm_silva
RE: This will convince you? by Le@ndro on 08-27-2008 at 12:55 AM
Thanks davidm_silva.
RE: RE: This will convince you? by CookieRevised on 08-27-2008 at 03:09 AM
quote:All this has got nothing, absolutely nothing, todo with the issue here.
Originally posted by Le@ndro
And have more: There are a brazilian version of MSN since 1999, the portuguese version started last year. Google has 2 offices in Brazil, 0 in Portugal. Yahoo! has a office in Brazil and don't have a portuguese site, only brazilian. When Napoleão decide invade Portugal, the royal family of Portugal came to Brazil, 100 years ago.
I want to show you the importance of Brazil actually. We aren't a underdeveloped contry anymore, we are going to be a world potence, probably the second biggest potence.
What on earth has the history of the royal family of Portugal todo with all this? Who cares where Google has offices. And if you're an underdeveloped or overdeveloped country doesn't matter one single bit.
So please, please, please! leave those kind of arguments out of this 234657432th discussion about this as they are completely irrelevant.
RE: This will convince you? by Choli on 08-27-2008 at 03:47 AM
yeah, I agree with Cookie.
Can a person who lives in Brazil understand and text written in portuguese by a person living in Portugal? And can a portuguese person understand a brazilian one? Yes, of course they can, because they speak the same language: portuguese. So there's no point in including another translation for protuguese.
(the same reasoning can be aplied to spanish: that's why we have just one spanish translation, which is valid for Spain and for all the South-american countries with spanish tongue: Argentina, Chile, Colombia, Uruguay, etc., etc., etc....)
RE: This will convince you? by Chancer on 08-27-2008 at 07:43 PM
Just to mention, it can be a little hard for a Brazilian to understand PT-PT the first time you read something. But any person, with the smallest IQ, can deduct what that means.
I'm sure that the same happens with Spanish speakers, and who speaks French, Dutch, and every single language. Each culture has its own vocabulary.
About the Chinese, if I'm not wrong, there are 2 alphabets (sets of ideograms), what is a good reason for 2 translations.
BTW, the royal family arrived in Salvador in 1808, which means 200 years ago. You'd better study more the history of you country.
BTW2, what's the point with that argument?? It may prove that the king was a coward, but doesn't mean Brazil was better than Portugal. And 200 years ago the Internet didn't even exist!
RE: This will convince you? by Voldemort on 08-27-2008 at 09:26 PM
quote:you're correct.
Originally posted by Chancer
About the Chinese, if I'm not wrong, there are 2 alphabets (sets of ideograms), what is a good reason for 2 translations.
RE: RE: This will convince you? by andrewdodd13 on 08-27-2008 at 10:39 PM
quote:So it's like when a Scotsman goes to London? Or when F. Canadians refuse to say four-twenty etc?
Originally posted by Chancer
Just to mention, it can be a little hard for a Brazilian to understand PT-PT the first time you read something. But any person, with the smallest IQ, can deduct what that means.
I'm sure that the same happens with Spanish speakers, and who speaks French, Dutch, and every single language. Each culture has its own vocabulary.
Perhaps, if it's not too much (which I guess it might be) some sort of differencing engine might be used. The one which really gets me in English is color vs. colour.
RE: RE: This will convince you? by Le@ndro on 08-28-2008 at 12:18 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Chancer
Just to mention, it can be a little hard for a Brazilian to understand PT-PT the first time you read something. But any person, with the smallest IQ, can deduct what that means.
I'm sure that the same happens with Spanish speakers, and who speaks French, Dutch, and every single language. Each culture has its own vocabulary.
About the Chinese, if I'm not wrong, there are 2 alphabets (sets of ideograms), what is a good reason for 2 translations.
BTW, the royal family arrived in Salvador in 1808, which means 200 years ago. You'd better study more the history of you country.
BTW2, what's the point with that argument?? It may prove that the king was a coward, but doesn't mean Brazil was better than Portugal. And 200 years ago the Internet didn't even exist!
Yes, it's 1808 when the royal family arrived in Salvador. I put wrong because when I wrote that was with few time, and I change with the arreved of the official japanese imigration(much history can be bad
).In the important thing: in some cases isn't very easy to understand the pt-pt. If a person see "Ecrã", and don't know what is it, it's dificult to discover. And have many diferences between the portugueses in the tecnology, in Brazil we talk Arquivo(File), in Portugal is Ficheiro, in Brazil is Telefone(cell phone), in Portugal is Telemóvel, and have more.
And if the Microsoft made a PT-BR version of Windows Live Messenger, why Messenger Plus! can't have? Has Microsoft products that arives in Brazil before Portugal. Don't have reason to prefer PT-PT. The most part of portuguese speakers of Plus! are brazilian.
And to end: If you do a test to enter in a university in Brazil using the PT-PT, probably you can't pass in the written part.
ps: I don't stop with this subject because you don't convince me that is better have Portugal Portuguese in the installer.
RE: This will convince you? by Spunky on 08-28-2008 at 12:50 AM
Theres nothing stopping people making a translation file themselves and distributing it AFAIK. I believe that if it's good enough it could be included anyway(?). I do know that the British English language file wasn't included and there are some differences in that too as well as the spelling of a few choice words IIRC
RE: This will convince you? by Chancer on 08-28-2008 at 12:50 AM
quote:And do you think that you can pass in Portugal because you speak Brazilian Portuguese? Bad argument.
Originally posted by Le@ndro
If you do a test to enter in a university in Brazil using the PT-PT, probably you can't pass in the written part.
quote:Do you convince us?
Originally posted by Le@ndro
I don't stop with this subject because you don't convince me that is better have Portugal Portuguese in the installer.
quote:Of course not. That's what I do.
Originally posted by SpunkyLoveMuff
Theres nothing stopping people making a translation file themselves and distributing it AFAIK.
RE: This will convince you? by Voldemort on 08-28-2008 at 12:56 AM
quote:there's no reason for us to convince you of anything. that's what patchou said and that's the way it works around here.
Originally posted by Le@ndro
ps: I don't stop with this subject because you don't convince me that is better have Portugal Portuguese in the installer.
RE: RE: This will convince you? by Le@ndro on 08-28-2008 at 01:46 AM
quote:No, I don't think that I can pass. I said it to show that the diferences make diference in some cases.
Originally posted by Chancer
quote:And do you think that you can pass in Portugal because you speak Brazilian Portuguese? Bad argument.
Originally posted by Le@ndro
If you do a test to enter in a university in Brazil using the PT-PT, probably you can't pass in the written part.
quote:I'm trying.
Originally posted by Chancer
quote:Do you convince us?
Originally posted by Le@ndro
I don't stop with this subject because you don't convince me that is better have Portugal Portuguese in the installer.
Eu sou brasileiro e não desisto nunca
RE: This will convince you? by CookieRevised on 08-28-2008 at 01:57 AM
quote:Similar things happen in other languages too. For example, in Dutch you have two major sublanguages: Dutch from Belgium and Dutch from the Netherlands. Although they share the same language, both countries have sometimes their own words for some stuff. And even in such a way that an X in the Netherlands means something completely different than X in Belgium. Or that Y isn't a known word in Belgium or Z isn't know in the Netherlands.
Originally posted by Le@ndro
In the important thing: in some cases isn't very easy to understand the pt-pt. If a person see "Ecrã", and don't know what is it, it's dificult to discover. And have many diferences between the portugueses in the tecnology, in Brazil we talk Arquivo(File), in Portugal is Ficheiro, in Brazil is Telefone(cell phone), in Portugal is Telemóvel, and have more.
Bottom line is that they share the exact same language and that there is a common language, that is what we call 'General Dutch'. And if 'General Dutch' is used, both Belgians and people from the Netherlands should/will understand that. You just need to avoid the words which might be interpreted differently.
The difference with Dutch and Portuguese might be that in Dutch technical terms are almost always exactly the same in Belgium as in the Netherlands (though, not always, but those are rare), whereas in PT-PT and PT-BR the differences might be very common.
But still, it is the same language.
On a sidenote: I think this world is comming to an end if even Chancer appears to be on the side of one language file in Plus!
RE: This will convince you? by Chrono on 08-28-2008 at 01:59 AM
Leandro, this subject has been discussed thousands of times, and i think it's been made clear already that Patchou won't add a brazilian translation (as for now).
Support the current brazilian translation (sticky thread in the translation forum) and someday it may be added, but posting threads like this one wont really help.
We used to have 2 different spanish translations when Plus! 3 was around, and with the release of Plus! 4, we decided to merge them. We have a single spanish translation now, which works well for both people in Spain and latin america. How so? The spanish team is composed by 2 people from spain and 2 people from latin america. I've always thought that there should be at least one brazilian translator in the portuguese team, so that the translation could be consistent for both countries, but that's beyond my powers
Thread closed.