Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? - Printable Version
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Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by yoinkster on 11-07-2009 at 05:08 PM
Hey guys,
today I was foced to "upgrade" to this live messenger pile of shit. The whole thing is, to be frank and very rude, fucking shit. Chat windows need to be massive to accommodate the unnecessary 34870878756308476380% increase in display picture sizes, the chat windows seem to be coloured as other people want them to be, ie, girls have them pink, I'm a man, I don't want pink fucking windows. And frankly, the rest of it is shit too, everything has been bloated and it's uglier dog's arse.
So basically, I want to downgrade (even though it'll be a massive improvement) to an older version that it'll let me use ... are there any older version that it will still let me use? I can see my 13 year love affair with MSN coming to a very sudden end because this new version makes me want to dig my eyes out with a spoon.
Thanks for your help 
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by tony on 11-07-2009 at 05:15 PM
Check this out:
http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=92...d=979138#pid979138
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by yoinkster on 11-07-2009 at 05:27 PM
Thanks a lot for that, certainly made me laugh:
bugs and security? Problematic for MS to improve it? Boo-hoo, had they not made this montrosity in the first place people wouldn't NEED to avoid it! Hopefully everyone will avoid it and then they'll ditch it due it being a pile of shit!
Will try to the reshack tool and see how it goes, just need to find a place to download msn 8.5 :/
you're an absolute star tony, thank you so much
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by EriktheRed on 11-07-2009 at 10:27 PM
Just to save creating a new thread since the one linked to in this topic has been locked... I have followed the instructions in that topic, and have gotten WLM to work in version 8 through ResHacker, but Plus! refuses to work no matter what I do. I'm on XP, my friends who have successfully gotten this to work are on Vista.
Is there anything I need to do differently than said in the topic?
RE: RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by CookieRevised on 11-07-2009 at 11:12 PM
quote:Sure, link to an even buggier version of 8.5!!! It surely will increase the amount of posts on the forum of people complaining their contacts are dissapearing, or unable to add more contacts, and who knows what other problems.
Originally posted by tony
http://www.msgstuff.com/downloads/file/.../
If you want to link to 8.5 and cause people to have even more problems, at least link to the latest version instead of to a beta version.
quote:There is not much different in version 2009 for the chat windows than what you are used to, other than that the DPs are now shown on the left side.
Originally posted by yoinkster
Chat windows need to be massive to accommodate the unnecessary 34870878756308476380% increase in display picture sizes,
quote:Then turn it off
Originally posted by yoinkster
the chat windows seem to be coloured as other people want them to be, ie, girls have them pink, I'm a man, I don't want pink fucking windows.
In a chat window: Tools > Use default scene.
quote:Errr... excuse me? Problematic? Sorry, but this "montrosity" as you call it is EXACTLY the fix for those bugs and security issues in the version you are using right now. There is nothing problematc about it. You make it problematic for insisting in using a buggy and insecure version.
Originally posted by yoinkster
Thanks a lot for that, certainly made me laugh:
bugs and security? Problematic for MS to improve it? Boo-hoo, had they not made this montrosity in the first place people wouldn't NEED to avoid it!
Tricking Messenger so you can use the older version WILL cause you even MORE troubles in the long rong. Even more, it will also cause problems for OTHER people.
quote:Yes, UPGRADE to Windows Live Messenger 2009.
Originally posted by EriktheRed
Just to save creating a new thread since the one linked to in this topic has been locked... I have followed the instructions in that topic, and have gotten WLM to work in version 8 through ResHacker, but Plus! refuses to work no matter what I do. I'm on XP, my friends who have successfully gotten this to work are on Vista.
Is there anything I need to do differently than said in the topic?
-----------
Sorry people, but you are bringing all these problems on to yourself!
Do NOT trick/hack Messenger; it WILL bring you more trouble.
Simply bite the bullet and upgrade. You will very quickly enjoy the new version.
Windows Live Messenger is NOT that bad. There are no features removed (except for a very very few which weren't used in previous versions that much anyways), and all the "bloat" you're talking about can also be turned off.
Also, I suggest to read this following pages. They explain _why_ the update is mandatory (because of a severe/critical security bug):
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/advisory/973882.mspx
http://messengersays.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!5B4...30829E!82557.entry
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by EriktheRed on 11-07-2009 at 11:28 PM
Sharing folders are critical and have been removed. Backgrounds are critical to differentiating between conversations easily and almost all functionality has been removed. Changing the look for no reason but to alienate consumers was insane. All aspects of customizability are gone, except for a one-inch bar at the top.
Please either try to help, or get your facts straight before you troll.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Menthix on 11-07-2009 at 11:37 PM
Microsoft Bob was critical to me, but I moved on.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by CookieRevised on 11-07-2009 at 11:42 PM
quote:They have been replaced by the much safer, much stabler and much more versatile SkyDrive. You don't even have to be online anymore to share files, and you can share files with more than one contact without the need to have multiple copies of a file, etc, etc...
Originally posted by EriktheRed
Sharing folders are critical and have been removed.
Of course, it is 'different' and you need to get used to something new, but SkyDrive is like 1000 times better. And believe me when I say that I know what I'm talking about as I used Sharing Folders extremely intensivly and was a bit sceptical at first too.
quote:Backgrounds are not removed. They are still there: Tools > Backgrounds...
Originally posted by EriktheRed
Backgrounds are critical to differentiating between conversations easily and almost all functionality has been removed.
The only difference is that they don't colorize the entire chat window anymore because of the new scenes features (which you can use to colorize the chat windows even further if you want).
You sure can still differentiate between chat windows/individual contacts using the current Backgrounds feature.
quote:Sorry but you can change the look far more than you could in previous versions.
Originally posted by EriktheRed
Changing the look for no reason but to alienate consumers was insane. All aspects of customizability are gone, except for a one-inch bar at the top.
(and then there are also skins in case you're also using Messenger Plus!)
At least take a minute to browse the menus and options of the new version instead of immediatly complaining and/or copying what other people say (who didn't took the time to at least check things out either).
quote:I think it is someone else who is trolling, EriktheRed.
Originally posted by EriktheRed
Please either try to help, or get your facts straight before you troll.
The stuff I say ARE facts. You can check everything I said yourself if you just do some effort instead of complaining and accusing me for being a troll.
And sure, I don't post what you want to hear. But posting what people want to hear is never "helping". Helping is trying to solve the issues people have in a _proper_ way. And yes, sometimes that means saying stuff which people do not want to hear.
The proper way of helping you guys is giving the advise to upgrade, weither you like it or not.
If you actually follow our advise and upgrade, you won't need to come back later to ask why you can't sign in anymore, why you sometimes get a login error, why your contacts aren't syncronized, why you can't add a contact, etc....
And, eventually, you will need to upgrade anyways because there will come a time that you wont even be able to log in with those older versions, eventhough you tricked/hacked them.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by EriktheRed on 11-08-2009 at 12:11 AM
I'd like to think that a mere graphical thing like Microsoft Bob is a bit different from a functional feature. Nice strawman argument.
I did use MSN 2009 before deciding to return to a more user-friendly version. I did do the effort. Please don't make assumptions. I was not satisfied with the reskinning options available through Plus!. I browsed through the entire options menu over a dozen times trying to make it bearable. I did not state that backgrounds were removed; I said almost all of their functionality has been removed. The fact that the majority of the chat window does not have the background makes using them simply jarring.
I will concede the point about sharing folders, as WLM did a poor job of informing me about their replacement, SkyDrive. I don't see how it could be safer, however.
And I think I'll know better than to ask on the Plus! forums about any problems concerning something that isn't Plus!. This isn't the official WLM forums, and it's quite obvious. I only asked about Plus!, and plan to keep it that way.
Does anyone have a solution, or not? That's all I've asked, and the sooner someone can help me the sooner I can be on my way. I didn't realize this was such a controversy.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by djdannyp on 11-08-2009 at 12:17 AM
There is on "controversy". The solution to your problem is to upgrade to Windows Live Messenger 2009. That's the plain and simple truth of it.
And to answer your question SkyDrive is safer as it doesn't rely on the files being shared between two computers, they are stored on a reliable server that will be backed up
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by CookieRevised on 11-08-2009 at 12:22 AM
quote:Can you explain why you weren't satisfied? Maybe there is something missing which could be added.
Originally posted by EriktheRed
I was not satisfied with the reskinning options available through Plus!
Although, every little pixel, object, button, etc in Messenger can be changed by using Plus! skins. You can even change the shape of the windows themselfs.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Harushionu on 11-08-2009 at 03:55 AM
For the record, all you little Microsoft kiss-ups, SkyDrive has been around for a very, very long time. It's available on the Windows Live profile pages and Hotmail. And guess what? It's open to anyone in your network. Sharing folders are private, only shared between two people. They were (and are) an excellent way to say, leave someone a photo you wish to share if they aren't online at the time, instead of uploading it to an image host or SkyDrive where it can be accessed by the whole planet.
tl;dr - SkyDrive has been around forever, they're only promoting it now. It's not an adequate replacement for sharing folders.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Menthix on 11-08-2009 at 04:04 AM
![[Image: skydrive-sharing.png]](http://random.menthix.net/mpl_screens/skydrive-sharing.png)
RE: RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by CookieRevised on 11-08-2009 at 04:08 AM
quote:Not a "very, very long time". It is only 2 years old as it was introduced in 2007 to a very limited set of countries. And it was only last year (2008) that it became available for everybody.
Originally posted by Harushionu
For the record, all you little Microsoft kiss-ups, SkyDrive has been around for a very, very long time.
quote:and from a lot more places too...
Originally posted by Harushionu
It's available on the Windows Live profile pages and Hotmail.
quote:Sorry but you are wrong!
Originally posted by Harushionu
And guess what? It's open to anyone in your network.
You can have private folders (just for yourself).
You can share a folder with just 1 contact in Messenger.
You can share a folder with more than 1 contact in Messenger.
You can share a folder with all your contacts in Messenger.
You can share a folder with everybody (even with people not in your contact list on Messenger).
You can have subfolders too...
And to take your photo-example: if you upload photos to SkyDrive the people, who have access to the folder where the photos are, can view the photos in a fotoalbum/slideshow. You can add comments, tag people, etc. This is called Windows Live Photos (which is part of SkyDrive).
You can share and work with multiple people on the same Office documents from within your browser. This is called Office Web Apps (part of SkyDrive).
You can share browser bookmarks if you wish, directly from within your browser. This is called Windows Live Favorites (part of SkyDrive).
You can download not only individual files from a SkyDrive folder, but also the whole folder at once as a zip file.
etc...
Thus please check your facts and actually try something out before trying to proof us wrong with something you have read somewhere on the net written by people who didn't checked things themselfs.
EDIT: Also see screenshot in previous post.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by ShawnZ on 11-08-2009 at 04:25 AM
quote:
Originally posted by yoinkster
ie, girls have them pink, I'm a man, I don't want pink fucking windows.
what's wrong with pink?!
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Harushionu on 11-08-2009 at 04:47 AM
I think I'll just trust myself not to be retarded with my computer and stick with my MSN8.5. Before more of you scream "YOU'RE VULNERABLE TO EVERYTHING HARMFUL EVER NOW. YOU'LL DIE IF YOU DON'T UPGRADE TO WLM," - WLM is overly graphic-heavy, looks like something strictly for 12 year-olds, and my laptop cannot handle it for more than a few minutes without crashing. Seriously, crying that it's a security risk is an admission that you don't know how to take care of your computer.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by ShawnZ on 11-08-2009 at 05:09 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Harushionu
Seriously, crying that it's a security risk is an admission that you don't know how to take care of your computer.
um.... wilfully running exploitable software is an admission that *you* don't know how to take care of *your* computer.
i'd prefer crappy performance to my contacts being able to run arbitrary code on my machine.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by blessedguy on 11-08-2009 at 01:30 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Harushionu
Seriously, crying that it's a security risk is an admission that you don't know how to take care of your computer.
And crying that a new, safer, reliable and required for some features version is the worst ever would be what?
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Nagamasa on 11-08-2009 at 03:54 PM
If you missed Sharing Folders...
1) Use SkyDrive and/or
2) Use Live Mesh.
Trust me, they're both better than Sharing Folders.
RE: RE: RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by yoinkster on 11-10-2009 at 03:01 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:There is not much different in version 2009 for the chat windows than what you are used to, other than that the DPs are now shown on the left side.
Originally posted by yoinkster
Chat windows need to be massive to accommodate the unnecessary 34870878756308476380% increase in display picture sizes,
quote:Then turn it off
Originally posted by yoinkster
the chat windows seem to be coloured as other people want them to be, ie, girls have them pink, I'm a man, I don't want pink fucking windows.
In a chat window: Tools > Use default scene.
quote:Errr... excuse me? Problematic? Sorry, but this "montrosity" as you call it is EXACTLY the fix for those bugs and security issues in the version you are using right now. There is nothing problematc about it. You make it problematic for insisting in using a buggy and insecure version.
Originally posted by yoinkster
Thanks a lot for that, certainly made me laugh:
bugs and security? Problematic for MS to improve it? Boo-hoo, had they not made this montrosity in the first place people wouldn't NEED to avoid it!
Tricking Messenger so you can use the older version WILL cause you even MORE troubles in the long rong. Even more, it will also cause problems for OTHER people.
-----------
Sorry people, but you are bringing all these problems on to yourself!
Do NOT trick/hack Messenger; it WILL bring you more trouble.
Simply bite the bullet and upgrade. You will very quickly enjoy the new version.
Windows Live Messenger is NOT that bad. There are no features removed (except for a very very few which weren't used in previous versions that much anyways), and all the "bloat" you're talking about can also be turned off.
Hi CookieRevised,
I came on with boiling blood but have now calmed down somewhat as I am now back on a superior product in 8.5
Firstly, the idea of peoples' windows coming up as they want you to see them is, in my eyes, a rediculous feature and should be off by default. I have got used to having very boring, very trimmed windows that don't intrude on my workspace that are tall and thin. These new chat windows DO have larger display pictures making them a lot wider and, as you point out, have inexplicably moved to the other side of the window. This just makes it feel unfamiliar and devalues the experience. I spent some time flicking through the options to find something along the lines of "override everyone elses' preferences and just show me my windows as I want them" but it wasn't there.
The monstrosity that has been created is not the fix for all those massive bugs you claim exist in 8.5 because it is simply not fit for purpose. It's like saying a half ton woman is a suitable solution for the problem of not being able to sleep with a Swedish bikini model any more. Yes, you may still get some action from the replacement but ... really, who would want to? My point was that I honestly couldn't give a rat's butt if I'm making it more problematic for MS to improve Live 2009 because frankly, they deserve all the stick they get for this particular product (and I'm normally a big fan of MS stuff). Again causing problems for other people comes a distinct and very distant LAST in my concerns, I can chat to people on an older version of MSN that I want to use and they can chat back to me, that's all I care about.
Since ResHacking MSN I have experienced a total of 0 problems with MSN and a further 0 problems with the features in Plus! that I use. My computer has exploded exactly 0 times and there have been a total of 0 attempts on my life from would-be MSN exploiters. Yes, you're right, I absolutely must use the new, worse, more infuriating version.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by Menthix on 11-10-2009 at 03:12 PM
Messenger 8.5 vs 2009 is like browsers, operating systems, religions and politics. One will never convince the other of their point of view by just words, it leads to endless discussions going nowhere.
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by honey114 on 11-10-2009 at 05:33 PM
I would install 2009, If the voice- and webcame would be "OK", but I the quality is really bad, why?
My friend has 2009, and I have 8.5, why does it work good, and 2009 and 2009 not?
RE: Avoid the new Live 2009 (version 14)?? by djdannyp on 11-10-2009 at 07:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by yoinkster
I have got used to having very boring, very trimmed windows that don't intrude on my workspace that are tall and thin. These new chat windows DO have larger display pictures making them a lot wider and, as you point out, have inexplicably moved to the other side of the window. This just makes it feel unfamiliar and devalues the experience.
You are aware that you can make the display pictures smaller, right? And that if necessary you can hide the display pictures from the contact windows completely?
quote:
Originally posted by yoinkster
I spent some time flicking through the options to find something along the lines of "override everyone elses' preferences and just show me my windows as I want them" but it wasn't there.
In a conversation window:
Tools>Use default scene
quote:
Originally posted by yoinkster
The monstrosity that has been created is not the fix for all those massive bugs you claim exist in 8.5 because it is simply not fit for purpose. It's like saying a half ton woman is a suitable solution for the problem of not being able to sleep with a Swedish bikini model any more. Yes, you may still get some action from the replacement but ... really, who would want to? My point was that I honestly couldn't give a rat's butt if I'm making it more problematic for MS to improve Live 2009 because frankly, they deserve all the stick they get for this particular product (and I'm normally a big fan of MS stuff). Again causing problems for other people comes a distinct and very distant LAST in my concerns, I can chat to people on an older version of MSN that I want to use and they can chat back to me, that's all I care about.
If you're so insistant that WLM 2009 is an inferior product, why would you want to do something which you know is hindering future development? Surely it would be more constructive to give them feedback on the "problems" that you are experiencing with WLM 2009 so that they can correct them in the future?
quote:
Originally posted by yoinkster
Since ResHacking MSN I have experienced a total of 0 problems with MSN and a further 0 problems with the features in Plus! that I use. My computer has exploded exactly 0 times and there have been a total of 0 attempts on my life from would-be MSN exploiters. Yes, you're right, I absolutely must use the new, worse, more infuriating version.
Good luck, because that won't last for long. And I think you'll be able to find many people who have no problems with WLM 2009...perhaps because they get the correct information on it before shouting about features being missing, when infact you're just not looking carefully enough.