New PC - Printable Version
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New PC by Veggie on 12-19-2009 at 12:21 PM
I am buying a new pc, this one isn't fast enough for the stuff i am doing these days.
I use some quite processor intensive programs (i'm an engineer):
- MATLAB
- SolidWorks
- AutoCAD
- Maple
Here is what i have at the moment:
Motherboard:
ASUS P7P55D PRO iP55 Socket LGA 1156 8 channel audio ATX Motherboard £136.84
Processor:
Intel Core i7 860 2.8GHz Socket LGA 1156 8MB L3 Cache Retail Boxed Processor £210.85
Memory:
Corsair 4GB (2x2GB) DDR3 1600MHz/PC3-12800 XMS3 Dominator Memory CL9 (9-9-9-24) £94.99
OS:
Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate - Licence and media - 1 PC - OEM - DVD - 64-bit - English £139.78 Probably going to switch this for retail
Other:
Enlight Internal 3.5" 15-in-1 Card Reader with Sim Card Reader £9.99
Sony AD-5240S 24x DVD±RW DL Internal SATA Black Bare Drive - OEM £15.99
120mm Black Case Fan - 4 pin connector £1.99
Akasa AK-959 Socket 1156 CPU Cooler £5.42
I am unsure about the memory to be honest seems pretty pricey... anyone with any helpful suggestions?
oh, and i haven't included a graphics card as i will be getting that at a later date. and i have the case and power supply...
one of the reasons for getting this soon is too buy it before the VAT goes back up in england.
RE: New PC by CookieRevised on 12-19-2009 at 07:56 PM
If you're going to run those kinds of apps the memory can't be high enough.
4Gb is also the absolute minimum for Win7 64bit to run smoothly, not even taking in account those apps. So you would benefit a lot with more memory (PS: it's totally useless to have more than 4Gb memory on a 32bit OS though). I would say have at least 6Gb. Preferably 8Gb or even more seeing the kind of apps you want to run. (PS: make sure those apps are the 64bit versions though, this will again be very benefitial)
Having enough memory can speed up your apps way more than investing in a slightly better CPU but having not much or the minimum amount of memory.
Memory is actually not that expensive anymore, you should realy invest in that. The thing which makes it expensive is the DDR3. If your motherboard also supports DDR2 I would buy that instead if you're short on cash (it is roughly twice as cheap). You will loose some performance speed, but at equivalent speeds that is actually not very noticable.
Also:
http://www.w7forums.com/windows-7-64-bit-vs-32-bit-t484.html
RE: New PC by Veggie on 12-19-2009 at 08:07 PM
Cheers Cookie, i will probably go for 8Gb DDR3. I didn't even mention the Finite Element Analysis software, i am tired of it crawling along, and i have access to the 64bit and multi-core version so will defiantly be making the most of that!
anyone got any opinions on the motherboard and processor? a lot of things have changed since i last build a pc.
RE: New PC by Chancer on 12-19-2009 at 08:27 PM
quote:I've been using Win7 64 since beta and it runs just fine with 2GB...
Originally posted by CookieRevised
4Gb is also the absolute minimum for Win7 64bit to run smoothly
I can run MATLAB with my Quad Q6600, but I've only used for simple calculations so far, and it's almost instantly even for not so simple integrations. But my brother has an identical PC running XP 32-bit and he runs MATLAB smoothly doing this complex calculations (I don't know what he does). He also runs AutoCAD Inventor fine.
In my opinion, you could start with 4GB and then buy more when needed.
You could maybe add a bluray drive, in case you watch movies... but I don't know if it's cheap or not. No idea.
And a final tip about MATLAB if you have never used the 64-bit version, its usage is different of the 32, so you may want install both until you get used to the 64-bit.
RE: New PC by CookieRevised on 12-20-2009 at 12:27 AM
quote:It would run, but slower than with 4GB, especially when you have all the bells and whistles. Most people realy recommend at least 4GB.
Originally posted by Chancer
I've been using Win7 64 since beta and it runs just fine with 2GB...
quote:Highly depends on what the motherboard supports. If there are only 2 slots, then he should buy 1 stick of 4GB in that case, and not 2 sticks of dual channel 2GB. Because otherwise he must throw away those two sticks when he wants to upgrade to 8GB (=2 sticks of dual channel 4GB). And as said, DDR3 is not that cheap to just throwing it away imho. If it was DDR2 then who cares.
Originally posted by Chancer
In my opinion, you could start with 4GB and then buy more when needed.
RE: New PC by ShawnZ on 12-20-2009 at 02:34 AM
the i7's DDR3 memory controller is triple channel. the number of RAM modules you have installed should always be a multiple of 3.
RE: New PC by albert on 12-20-2009 at 02:43 AM
If I had known you needed an i7 CPU, I would've hooked you up with my Intel EEP program deal.
Anyways, I7 rock. (I have a 920).
RE: New PC by Menthix on 12-20-2009 at 03:12 AM
quote:The ASUS P7P55D PRO seems to be a dual channel board (4 slots, 2 colored groups).
Originally posted by ShawnZ
the i7's DDR3 memory controller is triple channel
Also, not all i7s use triple channel. The 9xx models do, the 8xx models (which he picked) don't.
quote:Why switch to retail?
Originally posted by Veggie
OEM - DVD - 64-bit - English £139.78 Probably going to switch this for retail
RE: New PC by Phillip on 12-20-2009 at 05:43 AM
quote:Yes and 4GB would run slower than 2GB. Windows 7 runs perfectly fine with 2GB, though I would suggest getting atleast 4GB (even 8 if you can afford it) for what you are doing.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
It would run, but slower than with 4GB, especially when you have all the bells and whistles. Most people realy recommend at least 4GB.
quote:It's the X58 chipset that runs the triple channel memory controller. P55 is duel channel.
Originally posted by ShawnZ
the i7's DDR3 memory controller is triple channel. the number of RAM modules you have installed should always be a multiple of 3.
quote:Mines running at 3.6 with 6GB of ram (same type Vegie is looking at only tighter timings). Was working really well yesterday while everyone elses computer was lagging/freezing
Originally posted by albert
Anyways, I7 rock. (I have a 920).
.RE: New PC by Hank on 12-20-2009 at 06:27 AM
i stand by what Cookie said, im on Win764 bit an Memory usage is around 1.70GB of 4GH ram. an im on a old crappy AMD Dual Core 6000+ Cpu with a Crappy Mobo i wont replace till the computer actually dies on me
though i have been looking at the i5 intel cores . i dont need a i7
RE: New PC by prashker on 12-20-2009 at 06:56 AM
quote:
Originally posted by albert
If I had known you needed an i7 CPU, I would've hooked you up with my Intel EEP program deal.
Was planning on buying an i7 920 from NCIX.com on their Boxing Week Sale, if you can give it to me cheaper, mind hooking me up
?* prashker sends PM and spams on messenger
RE: RE: New PC by Phillip on 12-20-2009 at 10:13 AM
quote:Windows 7 (and Vista) are not like previous versions. They will try make use of as much ram as possible while doing simple things like browsing through your computer or browsing the internet. When you open a program that does require usage of the ram Windows 7 will allocate the memory needed to the program. If you were running Windows XP and your memory usage was around 1.7GB/2GB then yes I would be worried but 1.7GB is perfectly normal for Windows 7. Windows 7 will try max out your Ram modules to give you a nice fast experience. You should be able to open up 50 processes and then try watch a HD movie and it should play without skipping as Windows knows this is the program that needs the memory.
Originally posted by ICQ
i stand by what Cookie said, im on Win764 bit an Memory usage is around 1.70GB of 4GH ram. an im on a old crappy AMD Dual Core 6000+ Cpu with a Crappy Mobo i wont replace till the computer actually dies on me
RE: New PC by ShawnZ on 12-20-2009 at 03:29 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Phillip
It's the X58 chipset that runs the triple channel memory controller. P55 is duel channel.
oops, didn't see that
RE: New PC by Veggie on 12-28-2009 at 02:50 AM
right, im going to order it tommorrow, its just the memory that i am not sure about. not sure what all the timings are... goingto get 2x2Gb and double it later, but is the memory i chose 'good'? going to get a 10,000rpm HDD too i think
RE: New PC by Hank on 12-28-2009 at 03:02 AM
i would of went for Kingston DDR3 ram, i hear thats better than any others
RE: New PC by Menthix on 12-28-2009 at 10:51 AM
quote:Not true.
Originally posted by ICQ
i would of went for Kingston DDR3 ram, i hear thats better than any other
Kingston is an A-brand, and good in general, but that doesn't mean it's better than plaything else. There are plenty of other A-brands in memory. Also, Kingston and every other brand makes memory modules of different types, some faster than the other but that comes at a price.
The first thing when picking in memory is looking up your motherboard specs and see which types it supports. You won't be able to just use any type of DDR3 memory, look in the detailed specification page on the site of the motherboard manufacturer.
RE: New PC by albert on 12-28-2009 at 03:54 PM
quote:If you do have a little cash lying around, get an SSD drive, at least for your operating system. I have two of them (one desktop, one laptop) and let me tell you they're worth your money.
Originally posted by Veggie
get a 10,000rpm HDD too i think
RE: RE: New PC by andrewdodd13 on 12-29-2009 at 12:30 AM
quote:Just to point out, DDR2 prices have skyrocketed for some reason. I bought 2x2GB of Kingston PC2-8500 in May for £31. The cheapest I can find that stuff for now is £71.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Memory is actually not that expensive anymore, you should realy invest in that. The thing which makes it expensive is the DDR3. If your motherboard also supports DDR2 I would buy that instead if you're short on cash (it is roughly twice as cheap). You will loose some performance speed, but at equivalent speeds that is actually not very noticable.
Also I can't find the voltage information on that RAM you've got. You must make sure it is rated at less than 1.65V otherwise you will destroy the memory controller on your CPU.
Throw away that CPU fan as well, for £6 it's going to be dreadful (or least, no better than the one included with the CPU). Something like a Coolermaster or Zalman would be slightly more expensive (£10-£20) but would be adequate. I personally have a Noctua NH-U12P but it's probably seriously overkill if you're not overclocking.
--
And now I realise you've already ordered, my bad >.>
RE: New PC by Veggie on 12-29-2009 at 10:14 AM
haha dont worry, havent ordered yet... Yeah i knew about the voltage thing and have been looking at the supported list and have decided to go with,
Crucial 4GB (2x2GB) DDR3 1333MHz/PC3-10600 Memory Kit CL9 1.5V
will check the cpu fan, will probably just go with the stock. I have no real plans with overclocking, as this computer will perform well with default settings.
RE: New PC by Hank on 12-29-2009 at 10:23 AM
i know in Australia where i buy most my Hardware Ram is pretty dirt cheap ( DDR2 ) IMO i still think its to early to go to DDR3 stuff but thats my opinion only.
RE: RE: New PC by andrewdodd13 on 12-29-2009 at 04:40 PM
quote:You don't really have much of a choice any more. If you want Intel, you either get a quite old (and soon to be discontinued) S775 chip, or go DDR3 with S1156/1366. Since the memory controller is integrated, there's no option.
Originally posted by ICQ
i know in Australia where i buy most my Hardware Ram is pretty dirt cheap ( DDR2 ) IMO i still think its to early to go to DDR3 stuff but thats my opinion only.
With AMD I think even their latest chips support DDR2 and DDR3, but I've not looked at their AM3 stuff.
RE: New PC by Veggie on 01-03-2010 at 12:18 AM
thanks for the help, its now up and running!
I now need to decide on a graphics card (i thought an old pci card would do for a while, but win7 really doesnt like it).
Any suggestions? In a few weeks i will have around £150 to spend on one... I dont game that much, but use alot of CAD.
Dont know where to start, except ive always had no problem with nvidia so feel that i should stay with them.
RE: New PC by andrewdodd13 on 01-03-2010 at 11:32 AM
At that price range, nv GTX260 or ati HD5770. The ati has DirectX 11, but is slightly less expensive. Although if you're paying for your own electricity, the HD5770 might be better for you in the long run as it uses less.
The GTX260 is getting a bit old and dated now, however, it's still a mighty fine card.
For CAD purposes, however, I'm unsure. Generally for these sort of things you would go with nv's Quadro or ati's FireGL series, but they're all pretty expensive...
RE: New PC by Menthix on 01-03-2010 at 11:46 AM
quote:I Imagine most CAD applications are less demanding on the GPU than serious 3D games. Unless you're doing huge projects, but the average level in a 3D game is more complicated with a lot more textures and light sources than someone generally cooks up at home, not to mention fast movements in games.
Originally posted by andrewdodd13
For CAD purposes, however, I'm unsure
RE: New PC by Veggie on 01-03-2010 at 02:19 PM
i was looking at a gtx260, but that might be a bit overkill, these are the ones i have found so far...
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/160748
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/180051
whats with the rubbish company names?
i have a 700w psu so should be able to power wither of those, suggestions?
RE: New PC by prashker on 01-03-2010 at 04:14 PM
XFX for video card, they have Double Lifetime Warranties, as in if you ever sell the video card, they will have a lifetime warranty also.
Either XFX or EVGA video card that has a lifetime warranty.
RE: New PC by Menthix on 01-03-2010 at 04:22 PM
Did you ever manage to break a video card though? Not including DOA, extreme overclocking, physical damage, or driver issues (which except from DOA I doubt any company would ever cover).
RE: RE: New PC by andrewdodd13 on 01-03-2010 at 04:42 PM
quote:I guess so. In fact, I would imagine most basic CAD stuff can be handled by the CPU alone. For some reason I thought we were talking 3D modelling, in which case, the workstation graphics cards favour quality over performance (back when gaming cards didn't feature things like FSAA), although with programmable shaders I'm not quite sure what their point is anymore...
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:I Imagine most CAD applications are less demanding on the GPU than serious 3D games. Unless you're doing huge projects, but the average level in a 3D game is more complicated with a lot more textures and light sources than someone generally cooks up at home, not to mention fast movements in games.
Originally posted by andrewdodd13
For CAD purposes, however, I'm unsure
quote:
Originally posted by Menthix
Did you ever manage to break a video card though? Not including DOA, extreme overclocking, physical damage, or driver issues (which except from DOA I doubt any company would ever cover).
My 6600GT failed on me, without being overclocked, after about a year and a half.
Sapphire are one of the better ATI brands, but I also go for XFX (in fact I have an XFX HD5850 right now). I buy most of my gear from Overclockers UK now, they tend to have a better selection. Unfortunately the stock on all the HD5000 series is a bit crap at the moment.
RE: New PC by prashker on 01-03-2010 at 05:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Menthix
Did you ever manage to break a video card though? Not including DOA, extreme overclocking, physical damage, or driver issues (which except from DOA I doubt any company would ever cover).
Yes, and that's why I only buy good warrantied stuff now
Perfect example being: http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=53897
quote:
Originally posted by SonicSam
quote:nope
Originally posted by MeEtc
any warranty?
RE: New PC by Veggie on 01-03-2010 at 06:29 PM
Sapphire HD 5770 Vapor-X 1GB GDDR5 Dual DVI HDMI DisplayPort PCI-E
Looks pretty good...
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/189286
RE: RE: New PC by Phillip on 01-03-2010 at 07:10 PM
quote:Yep a 7600gt and a 3870. I have an XFX 295 GTX that feels like it is on it's way out also.
Originally posted by Menthix
Did you ever manage to break a video card though? Not including DOA, extreme overclocking, physical damage, or driver issues (which except from DOA I doubt any company would ever cover).
RE: New PC by foaly on 01-03-2010 at 09:24 PM
quote:I fried 3 video cards not doing anything strange...
Originally posted by Phillip
quote:Yep a 7600gt and a 3870. I have an XFX 295 GTX that feels like it is on it's way out also.
Originally posted by Menthix
Did you ever manage to break a video card though? Not including DOA, extreme overclocking, physical damage, or driver issues (which except from DOA I doubt any company would ever cover).
RE: New PC by Menthix on 01-03-2010 at 10:21 PM
* Menthix considers his self lucky