Plus! Games Language Support - Printable Version
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Plus! Games Language Support by Nathalie on 03-31-2010 at 02:04 PM
Hello everyone.
Most of you know about Plus! Games, by Messenger Plus! Live, one of Yuna’s new websites. www.plusgames.com
This site has been live for approximately three months, and is a work in progress. What I wanted to tell you about is the developments in the language support. Right now Plus! Games if fully supported in four languages - English (source language), Italian, Spanish (European) and French, and partially supported in 7 languages: English, Italian, Spanish, French, Portuguese (Brazilian), Turkish, and German.
For those of you who asked why you can’t see the language support, the site works in the language (if available) defined in your Internet browser. So to play the games in any of the seven languages mentioned, please change the default language in your browser.
If you're familiar with the site, here’s a quick overview. Let us know what you think!
Plus! Games lets you play games by yourself or challenge other players from the more than 62 million users of Messenger Plus! Live. You can choose from a wide variety of casual games (including classics like chess and 8-ball) and earn tokens to boost your playing experience – all for free. You can also connect to Facebook and invite your friends to play. Enjoy!
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Discrate on 03-31-2010 at 02:22 PM
Oh and don't forget you can BUY the tokens by using paypal or a credit card or you can complete "offers" 
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 03-31-2010 at 02:35 PM
So you have to pay to play flash games? 
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 03-31-2010 at 02:43 PM
You don't have to buy anything to play. You'll earn tokens by just playing for free. Buying is for lazy people.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Spunky on 03-31-2010 at 07:56 PM
Sorry, how is English fully and partially supported?
quote:
For those of you who asked why you can’t see the language support, the site works in the language (if available) defined in your Internet browser. So to play the games in any of the seven languages mentioned, please change the default language in your browser.
I have never heard anything so retarded
Just put a damn option in! Pick a language by default based on the browser's, but let us change it for when it screws up. There's no way I'd change by browser's default language just to play some games. Even use the user's choice from the Plus! Network home page, just do something rather than relying on a browser to give you an answer.The site seems like another way to show adverts (under the "more" link, although these are not even related to messenger, plus or anything people are care about or trust in and also the banner on the plusfun site.). Even the games link elsewhere (Catchphrase being a quick one I noticed again at plusfun seeing as plusgames is down) so I'm gussing you make more money that way too? I'm not saying a company making money is bad, but the fact is the only way Messenger and Messenger Plus! Live is connected is the use of the "Plus" name and the logo. It seems like Yuna is trying to ride the success of Plus! and make money off of it... Why not set up these websites under a different brand?
I'm having a bit of a rant at the moment and I don't really want to. I've kept quite about how I feel about Yuna et al, but these are the kinds of changes I was worried about.
OMG, it gets even worse:
quote:
Originally posted by Some shitty IQ test I could have made in under an hour
4 games for £7.50 per week. A joining fee of £3.00 shall apply.
quote:
Originally posted by Aforementioned Catchphrase game
This is a subscription service. You will receive 2 games of your choice for £3 per month until you send STOP to 88000
From what I can tell, these games are owned and operated by 3rd parties, which could damage the user's trust Plus! has built up, charge people extortionate amounts like the old "mobile phone TV adverts" did (notice you have to text to unsubscribe?). That whole site just shouts a shaky business model.
Is plusgames going to be any better? Will we be expected to download some sort of other Plus client next to be able play other Plus! users?
I'm not saying it's a bad idea to add services outside of the Messenger client, but don't do stupid things. Plus! Games would have been more sensible being dedicated to making games for Messenger. I know there is an SDK for it so why not hire people to do that instead of making multiple generic looking websites.
quote:
Originally posted by discrate
Oh and don't forget you can BUY the tokens by using paypal or a credit card or you can complete "offers"
Similar to a lot of other games out there such as Mafia Wars (well, all Zynga games really). The fact is people want to buy "reward points" etc to get an advantage and their whole concept works. This is asking people to pay for something I started doing at 11 years old with good old Macromedia Flash 7.
This is probably exactly what many people were afraid of, MP!L is now going to be surrounded by rumours of adverts, adware, spyware etc again because a 3rd party can charge people for a simple mobile download. I always thought Plus! would be free, because I believed in Patchou; so far, I don't put much stock in Yuna
[/WOT]
These are not meant to be hurtful comments, but my opinion on the way things are going. Great respect to Patchou for what he has accomplished with this and I wish Yuna to do well. Just out of curiosity, were any of the community involved at any stage of these sites? Consultation, design, thoughts? It just seems to be "look at what we did" and then silence and unimpressed looks. Maybe you could do something people want next time
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 03-31-2010 at 08:07 PM
quote:My thoughts EXACTLY. (the position I'm in atm i didn't say anything)
Originally posted by Spunky
Sorry, how is English fully and partially supported?
Similar to a lot of other games out there such as Mafia Wars (well, all Zynga games really). The fact is people want to buy "reward points" etc to get an advantage and their whole concept works. This is asking people to pay for something I started doing at 11 years old with good old Macromedia Flash 7.
This is probably exactly what many people were afraid of, MP!L is now going to be surrounded by rumours of adverts, adware, spyware etc again because a 3rd party can charge people for a simple mobile download. I always thought Plus! would be free, because I believed in Patchou; so far, I don't put much stock in Yuna
[/WOT]
These are not meant to be hurtful comments, but my opinion on the way things are going. Great respect to Patchou for what he has accomplished with this and I wish Yuna to do well. Just out of curiosity, were any of the community involved at any stage of these sites? Consultation, design, thoughts? It just seems to be "look at what we did" and then silence and unimpressed looks. Maybe you could do something people want next time
RE: RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Discrate on 04-01-2010 at 12:35 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Spunky
Sorry, how is English fully and partially supported?
quote:
For those of you who asked why you can’t see the language support, the site works in the language (if available) defined in your Internet browser. So to play the games in any of the seven languages mentioned, please change the default language in your browser.
I have never heard anything so retarded
The site seems like another way to show adverts (under the "more" link, although these are not even related to messenger, plus or anything people are care about or trust in and also the banner on the plusfun site.). Even the games link elsewhere (Catchphrase being a quick one I noticed again at plusfun seeing as plusgames is down) so I'm gussing you make more money that way too? I'm not saying a company making money is bad, but the fact is the only way Messenger and Messenger Plus! Live is connected is the use of the "Plus" name and the logo. It seems like Yuna is trying to ride the success of Plus! and make money off of it... Why not set up these websites under a different brand?
I'm having a bit of a rant at the moment and I don't really want to. I've kept quite about how I feel about Yuna et al, but these are the kinds of changes I was worried about.
OMG, it gets even worse:
quote:
Originally posted by Some shitty IQ test I could have made in under an hour
4 games for £7.50 per week. A joining fee of £3.00 shall apply.
quote:
Originally posted by Aforementioned Catchphrase game
This is a subscription service. You will receive 2 games of your choice for £3 per month until you send STOP to 88000
From what I can tell, these games are owned and operated by 3rd parties, which could damage the user's trust Plus! has built up, charge people extortionate amounts like the old "mobile phone TV adverts" did (notice you have to text to unsubscribe?). That whole site just shouts a shaky business model.
Is plusgames going to be any better? Will we be expected to download some sort of other Plus client next to be able play other Plus! users?
I'm not saying it's a bad idea to add services outside of the Messenger client, but don't do stupid things. Plus! Games would have been more sensible being dedicated to making games for Messenger. I know there is an SDK for it so why not hire people to do that instead of making multiple generic looking websites.
quote:
Originally posted by discrate
Oh and don't forget you can BUY the tokens by using paypal or a credit card or you can complete "offers"
Similar to a lot of other games out there such as Mafia Wars (well, all Zynga games really). The fact is people want to buy "reward points" etc to get an advantage and their whole concept works. This is asking people to pay for something I started doing at 11 years old with good old Macromedia Flash 7.
This is probably exactly what many people were afraid of, MP!L is now going to be surrounded by rumours of adverts, adware, spyware etc again because a 3rd party can charge people for a simple mobile download. I always thought Plus! would be free, because I believed in Patchou; so far, I don't put much stock in Yuna
[/WOT]
These are not meant to be hurtful comments, but my opinion on the way things are going. Great respect to Patchou for what he has accomplished with this and I wish Yuna to do well. Just out of curiosity, were any of the community involved at any stage of these sites? Consultation, design, thoughts? It just seems to be "look at what we did" and then silence and unimpressed looks. Maybe you could do something people want next time
I completely agree. I had the same reaction when i came across the site a couple of weeks ago.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Lou on 04-01-2010 at 01:57 AM
Nathalie, I think you should at least read your post before posting it; you can't fully support English and then at the same time only partially support English. 
As for the website, you contacted testers about things recently and never got back to any of us (whether it was questions, interest, etc.). Thanks for caring.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by CookieRevised on 04-01-2010 at 02:23 AM
Don't forget that Yuna Software is a company which does not only develop the Messenger addon called 'Messenger Plus!'. This was explained several times already in other threads.
That there were going to be more things than just the Messenger addon was something long ago announced by Patchou also, before the whole Yuna-takeover was announced. And later, after the takeover, it has been repeated several times too.
Second, Plus!Games != MsgPlus!...
Messenger Plus! will always be free. This is, again, said numerous times before. The games aren't forced upon you either. If you like to play more games, or want more stuff for your games you are free to buy some tokens. And in the future there might probably be more stuff you can do with such tokens too than just getting some extra credits for such games. The games are from 3rd parties, and in that way Yuna gains revenue. This is 1000 times better than a forced adware sponsor in Messenger Plus! itself, imho. In fact, many people have suggested doing exactly such thing before, back in the day the C2Media sponsor was there. This whole concept and business model is also exactly the same as so many other online game companies successfully use, there is no difference.
quote:So, I don't see how this is "exactly what many people were afraid of". Some people were/are afraid that Messenger Plus! would become payware, or riddled with adware. Although you have a point that it is under the same trusted branding of "Plus!", it is something different.
Originally posted by Spunky
This is probably exactly what many people were afraid of, MP!L is now going to be surrounded by rumors of adverts, adware, spyware etc again because a 3rd party can charge people for a simple mobile download. I always thought Plus! would be free, because I believed in Patchou; so far, I don't put much stock in Yuna
"Plus!" is not just the Messenger addon anymore; "Messenger Plus!" is, but not "Plus!". This is the same as the branding "Windows Live" (or the former "MSN"), which is way more than just an IM client.
quote:In regards to ways to gain revenue: it is one of the ways people want it to be. As for the involvement of the community: if we have comments, suggestions, etc, we can always contact Yuna (and please do, as the site can use improvements, like the language selection as you rightfully pointed out), that is exactly why Nathalie made that post. So why give the impression that you accuse Yuna for not getting the community involved? That announcement was _exactly_ made to get this community involved in the first place :/
Originally posted by Spunky
These are not meant to be hurtful comments, but my opinion on the way things are going. Great respect to Patchou for what he has accomplished with this and I wish Yuna to do well. Just out of curiosity, were any of the community involved at any stage of these sites? Consultation, design, thoughts? It just seems to be "look at what we did" and then silence and unimpressed looks. Maybe you could do something people want next time
Note also that the amount of players of those games already shows that they are on the right track with something like Plus!Games, at least for now. What the future will bring, nobody knows I guess (although a lot of such online game portals seem to spring alive in a burst with a massive user count before the active user count settles down)...
So, is it perfect? Of course not, and logic dictates they don't expect it to be perfect either. As Nathalie said so herself: "it is a work in progress". But that also doesn't mean you need to look at it in a big negative way just because it comes from Yuna, imho. Because from seeing some comments (not only in this thread or on this forum) it seems that for some people Yuna can't do anything good at all, no matter what they do.
I expect we can see more online services (beside games) to come our way in the future too.
------------------------------------------------------
quote:That seems nice, but it is unfortunalty way too limited. As Spunky has suggested: the user should always have the choice. Not everybody has the browser installed in their native tongue (especially in Europe). I strongly suggest to implement a system like the current Messenger Plus! site has, where the user always has the choice to switch languages and where the selected language is stored in a cookie for example.
Originally posted by Nathalie
For those of you who asked why you can’t see the language support, the site works in the language (if available) defined in your Internet browser. So to play the games in any of the seven languages mentioned, please change the default language in your browser.
Personally I think the Plus!Games site is a great alternative way to gain some needed revenue.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by albert on 04-01-2010 at 02:54 AM
I highly feel like commenting on the subject, but since I've been up for over 20hours, I'll just say I agree with cookie, and edit this post sometime tomorrow. 
RE: RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Nathalie on 04-01-2010 at 08:27 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Lou
Nathalie, I think you should at least read your post before posting it; you can't fully support English and then at the same time only partially support English.
Hi Lou,
You are right about the English. I meant that English is the source language for the site. I should have phrased it differently, but did mean that English was one of the languages supported.
Regarding the private messages from testers and translators, I'll be getting back to you all, one at a time. I apologize for the delay, but I was waiting for a few more responses.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Spunky on 04-01-2010 at 09:50 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
So, I don't see how this is "exactly what many people were afraid of". Some people were/are afraid that Messenger Plus! would become payware, or riddled with adware. Although you have a point that it is under the same trusted branding of "Plus!", it is something different.
I think people are more afraid of the loss of users due to the myth of adware etc due to all the adverts. We have already had threads on the forum asking about the Game of the Month button and why it is there when the user did not authorize it.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
that is exactly why Nathalie made that post. So why give the impression that you accuse Yuna for not getting the community involved? That announcement was _exactly_ made to get this community involved in the first place :/
I may have missed something, but nowhere in the post does it say they are looking for feedback. Ok, so there have already been PMs to Nathalie from testers and translators as I would have expected, but nowhere in the post does it ask for it. Even in the latest post acknowledging the feedback does it say anything will be done, just that they will receive a response.
As for the games at plusfun, I've seen too many people ripped off by this method of being automatically subscribed and having to text to unsubscribe, but being charged until you do. It all started with the "crazy frog" craze several years ago. You don't see them anymore in the UK as it was found most of them were dodgy and not doing what they said they would... Straight away people's trust in these games could be shattered,
Adverts shown on the site are deceiving (as most adverts used to be)... My IP has been selected as a potential winner. No sign that it is an advertisement as more and more honest companies are starting to do.
The website appears to be copyright 2010 Search Plus! - That in my opinion should be Yuna or Messenger Plus! If it's all going to be part of a brand, like Live, then the copyright shouldn't belong to a particular section of the brand, but the main product.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Note also that the amount of players of those games already shows that they are on the right track with something like Plus!Games, at least for now. What the future will bring, nobody knows I guess (although a lot of such online game portals seem to spring alive in a burst with a massive user count before the active user count settles down)...
I set up a gaming web site at college which had more users than I've currently seen online... That was mainly using a phpbb (I think) forum with an arcade. It's not the quality of the games for most people, but the fact it's something new and exciting that promises rewards.
I am now getting even more untargeted adverts including download accelerators, translators and PC repair tools. Most adverts I've seen are the types people have no learnt to avoid so I hope Yuna got a good deal with the Advertising company (HIgh CPC or a decent CPI rate)
quote:
Originally posted by Prject K Finally Revealed
Messenger Plus! will now be distributed with the Kaspersky Internet Security program and sold for a minor price. Of course, current users will receive a proper discount
/facepalm
Proper discount had better mean free...
EDIT: If this is going to be an April's Fool Joke, it would be in really bad taste considering the current mood the community seems to mostly be in.
RE: RE: Plus! Games Language Support by CookieRevised on 04-01-2010 at 10:33 AM
quote:True, but those are very rare.
Originally posted by Spunky
quote:I think people are more afraid of the loss of users due to the myth of adware etc due to all the adverts. We have already had threads on the forum asking about the Game of the Month button and why it is there when the user did not authorize it.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
So, I don't see how this is "exactly what many people were afraid of". Some people were/are afraid that Messenger Plus! would become payware, or riddled with adware. Although you have a point that it is under the same trusted branding of "Plus!", it is something different.
To get things correct, by "people" do you mean the testers/translators/you/me/etc or the general public?
If you mean the testers etc you might be right it is a concern, but if you mean the general public, I don't think the public lays awake of how many users Plus! might or might not loose because of misplaced assumptions that Plus! wouldn't be free because there is a 'related' site which shows ads or where you can pay for more games. In that case it makes more sense for them that they lay awake about Plus! being free or not because that would 'hurt' them in their own pocket.
quote:
Originally posted by Spunky
quote:I may have missed something, but nowhere in the post does it say they are looking for feedback. Ok, so there have already been PMs to Nathalie from testers and translators as I would have expected, but nowhere in the post does it ask for it. Even in the latest post acknowledging the feedback does it say anything will be done, just that they will receive a response.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
that is exactly why Nathalie made that post. So why give the impression that you accuse Yuna for not getting the community involved? That announcement was _exactly_ made to get this community involved in the first place :/
quote:Sounds perfectly like asking for feedback to me...
Originally posted by Nathalie
If you're familiar with the site, here’s a quick overview. Let us know what you think!
quote:Well, you do have a point though. As a matter of fact, in Europe (or it might be in some individual European countries, not sure atm) some laws have been created since then because of such abuse of such subscriptions.
Originally posted by Spunky
As for the games at plusfun, I've seen too many people ripped off by this method of being automatically subscribed and having to text to unsubscribe, but being charged until you do. It all started with the "crazy frog" craze several years ago. You don't see them anymore in the UK as it was found most of them were dodgy and not doing what they said they would... Straight away people's trust in these games could be shattered,
But as long as it is clear how to unsubscribe and that you can unsubscribe at any moment, there is nothing abusive or illegal (or imho, dodgy) about it. It would be the very same as so many other subscriptions on magazines etc where you have an annual automatic payment (until you unsubscribe 3 months in advance or something etc). The moment there is some illegal behaviour, be sure to report it and I'm 100% sure Yuna will take actions. Because that wouldn't be good for their rep either.
quote:Didn't noticed it yet. But yeah, that is a bit strange...
Originally posted by Spunky
The website appears to be copyright 2010 Search Plus! - That in my opinion should be Yuna or Messenger Plus! If it's all going to be part of a brand, like Live, then the copyright shouldn't belong to a particular section of the brand, but the main product.
quote:Except for the "you've won 10 credits (... when you log in as a facebook user)" ad I don't see any ads on that site. What ads are you talking about? Are you sure they are coming from the website and not from the toolbar for example?
Originally posted by Spunky
I am now getting even more untargeted adverts including download accelerators, translators and PC repair tools. Most adverts I've seen are the types people have no learnt to avoid so I hope Yuna got a good deal with the Advertising company (HIgh CPC or a decent CPI rate)
[OFF TOPIC]
quote:CookieRevised's reply to [split] Project K finally revealed
Originally posted by Spunky
quote:
Originally posted by Prject K Finally Revealed
Messenger Plus! will now be distributed with the Kaspersky Internet Security program...
[/OFF TOPIC]
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 11:01 AM
quote:There's at least 2 banners per page on plusgames.com. Running ad blocking software maybe? Although I'm not really concerned about that, it's usual for flash game site, most of them are more ad-heavy...
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Except for the "you've won 10 credits (... when you log in as a facebook user)" ad I don't see any ads on that site. What ads are you talking about? Are you sure they are coming from the website and not from the toolbar for example?
http://www.flashgames247.com/
http://www.miniclip.com/
http://www.addictinggames.com/
http://armorgames.com/
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Spunky on 04-01-2010 at 11:02 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Except for the "you've won 10 credits (... when you log in as a facebook user)" ad I don't see any ads on that site. What ads are you talking about? Are you sure they are coming from the website and not from the toolbar for example?
![[Image: 9paIX.png]](http://imgur.com/9paIX.png)
Ok, fair enough with the "Let us know what you think" comment, but it's not the most obvious thing (No excuses for me not seeing it though)
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
To get things correct, by "people" do you mean the testers/translators/you/me/etc or the general public?
I meant mainly the community; we all care about the success of Plus! and are heavily invested in it ourselves, not monetarily but with all the time and effort we have put in to give it a good name and make a good experience for the end-users.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Well, you do have a point though. As a matter of fact, in Europe (or it might be in some individual European countries, not sure atm) some laws have been created since then because of such abuse of such subscriptions.
My general feeling about this is that these companies all but went into hiding when these new rules came in. I have seen one advert in the last 2 years (the other day actually), which could potentially mean that these subscriptions are not working anymore...
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 11:22 AM
quote:The Netherlands seems very different in that regard. Although crazy frog is something of the past, ads for ringtones and mobile applications are being advertised daily in a subscription model on almost every national TV channel. Although I did notice these days those ads usually start later in the evening. Don't know if that's because of new laws around it, or just because those ad slots are cheaper, or because of the self regulation they are attempting around these type of services.
Originally posted by Spunky
I have seen one advert in the last 2 years (the other day actually), which could potentially mean that these subscriptions are not working anymore
RE: RE: Plus! Games Language Support by CookieRevised on 04-01-2010 at 11:22 AM
quote:Nope, I don't have any ad blocking in any way... strange....
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:There's at least 2 banner per page on plusgames.com. Running ad blocking software maybe? Although I'm not really concerned about that, it's usual for flash game site, most of them are more ad-heavy...
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Except for the "you've won 10 credits (... when you log in as a facebook user)" ad I don't see any ads on that site. What ads are you talking about? Are you sure they are coming from the website and not from the toolbar for example?
http://www.flashgames247.com/
http://www.miniclip.com/
http://www.addictinggames.com/
http://armorgames.com/
EDIT: both spaces are blank... although I now notice I do have script errors on that page too... maybe it is related...
(click to enlarge)
-------------
Regarding those phone subscriptions and ads for them on TV and other media: you have them a lot in Belgium too, but you are always able to unsubscribe from them (without additional costs) at any time. In fact, every ad and every sms you receive explicitly states how to unsubscribe (which started to happen after those new laws I refered to). So I can only hope that those 3rd parties which offer those subscriptions do the same proper thing. If not, I'll be shouting out too...
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 04-01-2010 at 01:49 PM
Plus! Will always be free? Ok, fair enough.. if Plus! stays the same we wont be effected, but all these 'extra' Plus! sites make Messenger Plus! look bad.
It's labelled as dangerous and dodgy by a lot of people/companies. Making sites like this is just going to make things a hell of a lot worse. Ok, the games sites are fine but I think everyone in this thread thought the same when they first saw it.
Especially when they have the right to give our personal details to to other companies for marketing purposes.
quote:
Originally posted by Privacy Policy
Our database of personal details (however we collect these details) is used by us, and third parties acting on our behalf, for administration and marketing related purposes.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 02:32 PM
quote:This is the alternative to CiD popups though, which is the real reason why Plus! is being "labelled as dangerous and dodgy by a lot of people/companies".
Originally posted by Chrissy
these 'extra' Plus! sites make Messenger Plus! look bad.
It's labelled as dangerous and dodgy by a lot of people/companies. Making sites like this is just going to make things a hell of a lot worse.
CiD was a company nobody ever heard of, which (if you chose to install the sponsor) would pop up pure advertisements randomly while you were browsing the internet.
PlusGames is powered by Come2Play and the toolbar is powered by Conduit. Both are legit companies, with funding by external investors, and known and used by many other respected companies. Unlike CiD if Come2Play/Conduit are doing dodgy things we'll know who is responsible and they'll be more motivated to do something about it since they investors and other customers to think about too while CiD as an anonymous company didn't have a reputation to care about.
It's not perfect, and certainly a work in progress. But I prefer this method over CiD. I think it can go somewhere if people can voice their criticism in a constructive way, and Yuna (and their partners) are willing to listen and take action on real issues. Perhaps using this over CiD Plus! can eventually even get rid of the label put on by certain companies. Does Meebo have a bad label for using Come2Play? Does TechCrunch have a bad label for having a Conduit toolbar?
quote:Where did you get that from? Can't find it in the PlusGames policy, neither in the one of Messenger Plus! itself (available in the Plus! installer) or the one of the toolbar.
Originally posted by Chrissy
Especially when they have the right to give our personal details to to other companies for marketing purposes.
quote:
Originally posted by Privacy Policy
Our database of personal details (however we collect these details) is used by us, and third parties acting on our behalf, for administration and marketing related purposes. We can sell..
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 04-01-2010 at 02:38 PM
quote:No, they don't. However, Ad-Ons for Windows Live Messenger all have a dodgy reputation anyway. Look at smiley central, runrocker etc etc. Just because Plus! is legit, being in a market that is know to be 'dodgy' is risky anyway. Not to mention this Plus! sites.
Originally posted by Menthix
Does TechCrunch have a bad label for having a Conduit toolbar?
If someone installs a dodgy MSN/WLM Add-on (we all know there's LOADS out there) and it ends up in bad consequences that user will take a lot of persuasion to install another add-on like Plus!
You gotta see my point, and I don't usually give it.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 02:48 PM
Seriously, where did you get that privacy policy quote from??
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 04-01-2010 at 03:11 PM
http://www.plusnetwork.com/privacy.php
Under 'Use of your personal details'.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 03:55 PM
quote:It does say "Our database of personal details (however we collect these details) is used by us, and third parties acting on our behalf, for administration and marketing related purposes." there. Nowhere does it say "We can sell..". If fact it says: "We do not rent, sell or disclose your contact details to any other third party."
Originally posted by Chrissy
http://www.plusnetwork.com/privacy.php
Under 'Use of your personal details'.
The policy you are supposedly quoting from is for plusnetwork.com and plusfun.com. On Plusnetwork.com the only personal data you're giving them is what your browser is automatically sending to every site you visit, and the search queries you enter in the searchbox. The search queries, if you want to consider them personal details, are indeed used by Ask.com as a third party acting on their behalf for marketing purposes (contextual advertising). Plusfun.com (although personally not a fan of it) only links out to third party sites directly, which have their own policies.
Plus! Games (PG), where this thread was originally about, has its own privacy policy which doesn't state anything like you quoted. In fact it says:
quote:For the "except as described" part I suggest you read the full policy yourself.
Originally posted by http://www.plusgames.com/welcome/privacy_policy/
PG does not sell, license, lease or otherwise disclose personal information to third parties, except as described in this Privacy Policy.
Other Yuna Software have their own privacy policies too:
- The Messenger Plus! Live software has its own privacy policy which is displayed during installation of the software. It makes no mention of sharing/selling personal information.
- The Messenger Plus! Toolbar privacy policy states:
quote:
Originally posted by http://messengerpluslive.ourtoolbar.com/privacy/
the Application does not collect or transmits personally identifiable information and does not monitor your personal use of the Application. - The Messenger Plus! website privacy policy states:
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.msgpluslive.net/privacy/
MP!L collects no personal information about who visits the site.
Again, nowhere your quote of "We can sell.." can be found. Please don't make things up. And next time you do find something, please quote full sentences and link to the source directly so everything can stay in context.
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Chrissy on 04-01-2010 at 03:59 PM
We can sell was actually meant to be put out with the quote. Sorry about that, I apologize.
On the other hand, it says, if they want they can send us emails related to our interests to 'advertise' their products. If no information is collected why would the terms say we may give your details to XYZ?
Also, there must be more information than just that collected as you are playing with millions of Plus! users. How can they be identified?
RE: Plus! Games Language Support by Menthix on 04-01-2010 at 05:13 PM
quote:That's a good point. Neither plusnetwork.com or plusfun.com can collect emailaddresses as far as I can see, except from the third parties they link to from those sites, but those have their own policies anyway.
Originally posted by Chrissy
On the other hand, it says, if they want they can send us emails related to our interests to 'advertise' their products. If no information is collected why would the terms say we may give your details to XYZ?
The policy doesn't mention how (or even if) emailaddresses are collected. These policies tend to be written by legal people who like to cover every aspect even if they aren't directly relevant to the current situation. In the sense of "if we would be collecting emailaddresses we will use them newsletters and other related matters". Also how emailaddresses would be collected is the important part, and unfortunately not mentioned. As long as it is done in an opt-in way with a method to opt-out afterwards it is perfectly fine. For example a form people can optionally fill in to subscribe to a Messenger Plus! Newsletter so they can receive news about new versions is legally a way of collecting emailadresses. Collecting user's emailaddresses without their explicit permission is something completely different and depending on how you do it illegal in several countries.
The license agreement when installing the Messenger Plus! software does refer to http://www.plusnetwork.com/privacy.php so you could interpreted it as that policy being valid for the Messenger Plus! software too (as well as for plusnetwork.com or plusfun.com). That would explain why it mentions "contact details". But I know the Plus! software isn't collecting any email addresses either. Usage statistics for Plus! are sent as unidentifiable number. Think of it as an MD5 hash on your emailaddress. It's not actually MD5, but irreversible nonetheless.
quote:Than just what? Haven't checked, but I assume PlusGames is using some kind of non-personal session ID stored in a cookie if you're playing as guest. When you decide to register it's either email address or Facebook Connect. But don't confuse plusnetwork.com/plusfun.com with PlusGames.
Originally posted by Chrissy
there must be more information than just that collected as you are playing with millions of Plus! users. How can they be identified?