Shoutbox

Well, I'm justdisapointed to see that we talked for nothing becaues in the end, you've done the maximum to write a page that's against Messenger Plus!, without giving a chance to your users to understand that this is not about uninstalling a trojan that will format your hard disk. You accuse me of bing misleading, you are absolutely no different and pages like yourswill continue to justify the existence of my facts page, so that people can get a refreshing point of view from time to time.

Don't say you're opened to suggestions, we've talked a lot with you and the current result is no different, if not worse, than the original page. I would have hoped you understand the situation better.

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Originally posted by Devilin
Fact, once downloaded, the zip files name, is msgplus, again no mention of C2 media

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of course, as the sponsor is that, just a sponsor -_-
or the filename of kazaa was "kazaa-bundled by thousands of spyware programs" ? they never let u know about them.

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Originally posted by Devilin
Fact once unziped  the file is under the name msgplus-setup, again no mention of C2 media,

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again, u are downloading messenger plus! which optionally has adware, why would it be stated in the filename? it would be so long. and does any other program do that? (mention some of them if u are gonna say "yes" ).

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Originally posted by Devilin
fact Only on the third screen during installation is C2 media mentioned

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u dont really get the facts right -_- on the second page it already warns u about the sponsor. the "next" button takes some seconds to enable itslef, so the user _reads_ that window. it warns u that in the next screen, the sponsor's agreement will be displayed.

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Originally posted by Devilin
? you are joking aren't you ?

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after reading all your posts, i think you are the one who's joking
you talk about facts, but your page is always made "from the begginers point of view", and miss some facts, like what cookie mentioned through all his posts.

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Originally posted by Devilin
I'm prepared to listen and adjust my page to any request, but I will not be used as a platform, to promote a one sided distorted point of view

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your page is a distorted point of view. it's the begginers distorted point of view, as you stated.


PS: the title is already in two lines, in 800*600 mode

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Originally posted by Devilin
and the The Virgule/  certainly are revealed
http://englishplus.com/grammar/00000140.htm

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Like I said, even if it does mean "and" or "or",  the statement "Plus! / C2media" is wrong by those same facts.
* You don't remove Messenger Plus! "OR" C2Media => C2Media is the name of a company, a company can not be uninstalled from your computer.
* You don't remove Messenger Plus! "AND" C2Media => C2Media is the name of a company, a company can not be uninstalled from your computer
* Messenger Plus! is NOT made by C2Media

Oh, and reread that page and use your common sense. (Sam Spade, take also note) The overall rule for the slant bar ("/") means both parts on both sides should be interpreted as EQUAL, aka ALTERNATIVES (and even the dictionaries back me up on this). And that is why I said it means "=".

Also, you use the slant in your page on the most impossible places, so don't go telling me what the meaning is of the slant and when to use it or not...

Furthermore:

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Originally posted by Devilin
I was asked to include the name C2 media

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Do not lie. You were asked to inlcude "SPONSOR (C2MEDIA)", nothing else! It is you who made it into the wrong, distorted and misleading title. Or must I refresh your memory by pointing out the original thread?

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Originally posted by Devilin
I'm prepared to listen and adjust my page to any request, but I will not be used as a platform, to promote a one sided distorted point of view

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YOU are NOT prepared to listen and/or adjust the page unless it fits in your distored narrow minded view!

In fact I don't understand what you want. We clearly talked to you in a civil unbiased sense. We only once suggested to include the "the facts"-page, without creating multiple threads/rants about it. You didn't want it to do as you think it is biased. Fine... respect to that. We didn't mention it again.

We NEVER wanted to use your page as a platform to promote Plus!. You are too narrow minded and biased to even see/understand that....

I can see clearly now that you even don't know the difference between a point of view and an unbiased fact. Maybe even if my arguments weren't 100% correct, in the end the meaning of your title is still incorrect even by your own standards and facts, see above.

And indeed, as Chrono said, the title is already split up into 2 lines on 800x600 screenresolution. A screenresolution which is still often used by people on the net. And furthermore, a webpage is something that needs to be dynamic; it should display fine on every resolution. You can't pin yourself on "it will distort the layout". If you do that, then you obviously do not know what the essence is of the web and how to create webpages.

I gave you the benefit of doubt and offered again and again alternatives to the title (including the word "c2media"). Yet you still ignored to even comment on those alternatives. Simply because you KNOW that those alternatives were correct and fitted in the space.

Instead you relentlessly tried to find the very small inaccurate things in my arguments just to justified your big suggestive and biased view of things.

So, you see, it is not us who are biased and narrow minded. And that is even supported by the fact that you say you don't have the time to investigate things, yet comming up with all suggestive, wrong ideas and things which are totaly based on nothing except your own fantasy and paranoidness.

Let me tell you that I know persons who also don't share the view that we have about Plus! and its sponsor, but at least they take the time to investigate and try to explain the things in the right context. Although they don't exceed in it in OUR point of view they still state the facts as they are, only they interprete them differently. You don't even state the facts correct.

(and then I even didn't mention the other wrong things on some of your other pages of which even I aren't affiliated with and have nothing todo with IM'ing)

You want to be an objective reporter of things, and let every view pass the revue? Well let me tell you that you grandly failed...

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Originally posted by Chrono

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Originally posted by Devilin
Fact, once downloaded, the zip files name, is msgplus, again no mention of C2 media

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of course, as the sponsor is that, just a sponsor -_-
or the filename of kazaa was "kazaa-bundled by thousands of spyware programs" ? they never let u know about them.

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Originally posted by leito.gtI read Devilin's page again, and it looks better, but from the beggining, the title "How to remove Messenger Plus" isn't accurate.

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Originally posted by leito.gtI suggested the use of "(C2Media)" because we, people, need to name things and because, users could do a basic research about C2Media, before or after uninstalling it.

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So I changed it,

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Originally posted by CookieRevisedAs I sated in a private post to you, the title "How to remove Messenger Plus 3 / C2Media" _IS_ wrong. You talk about distorted statements and misleading information, well this title is a distored statement and misleading information itself. And that is not a biased opinion, it is a fact.

1) Messenger Plus! 3 is not C2Media
2) Messenger Plus! 3 is not made or from C2Media
3) The sponsor is from C2Media
4) Your guide does not explain how to uninstall C2Media. In fact you can not uninstall C2Media, as this is a company name.

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Thus above I was explaining how, you couldn't realistically differentiate between the two programs, from a beginners point of view, and how the confusion would start,

Add C2Media remove C2Media------make up your minds please

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Because Messenger Plus doesn't install alone and if somone install it with the sponsor, he/she will just want to remove Messenger Plus's Sponsor.

I suggest the title is changed to "How to remove Messenger Plus's Sponsor (C2Media)

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It won't fit, try an abbreviations

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Originally posted by Devilin
Fact once unziped  the file is under the name msgplus-setup, again no mention of C2 media,

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again, u are downloading messenger plus! which optionally has adware, why would it be stated in the filename? it would be so long. and does any other program do that? (mention some of them if u are gonna say "yes" ).

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I believe this is answered above

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Originally posted by Devilin
fact Only on the third screen during installation is C2 media mentioned

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u dont really get the facts right -_- on the second page it already warns u about the sponsor. the "next" button takes some seconds to enable itslef, so the user _reads_ that window. it warns u that in the next screen, the sponsor's agreement will be displayed.

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The second screen displays the text sponsored program, the text C2 media, isn't used until the third page, my facts, are extremely straight,

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Originally posted by Devilin
? you are joking aren't you ?

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after reading all your posts, i think you are the one who's joking
you talk about facts, but your page is always made "from the begginers point of view", and miss some facts, like what cookie mentioned through all his posts.

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Undoubtedly by page will miss lots of facts, both positive and negative, try reading my posts again, my aim was a simple easing to understand page, unbiased in its approach,

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Originally posted by Devilin
I'm prepared to listen and adjust my page to any request, but I will not be used as a platform, to promote a one sided distorted point of view

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your page is a distorted point of view. it's the begginers distorted point of view, as you stated.

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If you point out, these distortions, I'll be happy to amend them, if I truly wished to produce a distorted and un true page, I wouldn't be here, now would I

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PS: the title is already in two lines, in 800*600 mode

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Not in IE , firefox, isn't the most popular browser --yet but good for you for using it, I'm still trying to overturn the Cross browser distortions 

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Posted by Patchou - Today at 07:39 AM
Well, I'm justdisapointed to see that we talked for nothing becaues in the end, you've done the maximum to write a page that's against Messenger Plus!, without giving a chance to your users to understand that this is not about uninstalling a trojan that will format your hard disk. You accuse me of bing misleading, you are absolutely no different and pages like yourswill continue to justify the existence of my facts page, so that people can get a refreshing point of view from time to time.

Don't say you're opened to suggestions, we've talked a lot with you and the current result is no different, if not worse, than the original page. I would have hoped you understand the situation better.

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I'm sorry you feel that way, obviously the page isn't pro messenger plus enough for you, even though it suggests you can use messenger plus, without the sponsor at the bottom of the page, ------ which in a way is good, I didn't wish to write a pro messenger plus page, I didn't wish to write a anti messenger plus page, its also been suggested, from the anti brigade, that the page is far to pro, I'm happy to have reached a point, where you don't both like it equally,  mine is the beginners point of view, one that just doesn't care, that just wants a solution to a problem, not propaganda from either side

And I'm sure if your facts page, is entirely correct, nobody will ever have any problems, uninstall messenger plus or its sponsor program, nobody will ever need assistance on other help forms, so logically nobody will ever see my page, a lot of fuss over nothing wouldn't you say

ok, Devilin, to be quite honest, and hopefully speaking for the rest of the forum...

i believe you are picking fights that are not needed.
cookie revisited, please dont agrovate our guest.

visit http://www.msgplus.net/getthefacts.php

if you disagree, then shame on you....

end of story if you ask me

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Originally posted by Devilin
Add C2Media remove C2Media------make up your minds please

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We NEVER told you to just add "C2Media", reread that other thread...

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Originally posted by Devilin
mine is the beginners point of view, one that just doesn't care, that just wants a solution to a problem, not propaganda from either side

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This whole thread is about the TITLE, NOTHING ELSE. Changing the title like I said before, is no propaganda in any way, if you would see that we wouldn't had this discussion at the moment...

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Originally posted by Stigmata
ok, Devilin, to be quite honest, and hopefully speaking for the rest of the forum...

i believe you are picking fights that are not needed.
cookie revisited, please dont agrovate our guest.

visit http://www.msgplus.net/getthefacts.php

if you disagree, then shame on you....

end of story if you ask me

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I certainly didn't intend or Institute this, but I can see what you mean, your entirely correct, I will not visit this forum anymore to stop any more sillyness, if anybody wishes to contact me in a serious way, about adjusting the page, use my form on my site,

Have fun all

Just wanted to say that i choose not to install anything else than the plus itself and my pc got full undesirable behaviours (Something was installed that i did not wanted to)
I will not install it anymore, because I don't know if it is possible to get only the app.
You should write in BIG letters, what the prog does exactly to our pc's and what behaviours will it create whitout us knowing how to disable them.
I'm not talking about the app itself, im talking about the litttle things that come whit it.

Don't believe anything I say, i'm a liar, but wooud apreciate an answer. Sorry for my english.

Devilin: Thanks for your page, gave me some information i didn't know about. My time is to precious to spend it reading small text.

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Originally posted by Devilin
With no replies, I'll assume everybody's happy
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The thread, was quickly disappearing, it had over 30 viewers with no replies, although I appreciate the time and effort everybody in this forum gives, I also have other interests which limits my time

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Firstly, I would like to say something about this first. I saw this thread minutes after you posted it. I actually wanted to post something, but I didnt. Know why? Cause I wanna to let others speak first; I feel that I dont really have the right to speak in all your discussions with Patchou, CookieRevised, others and you, judging from the previous discussions that you all had the other time. Do you need a link to that page? I bet that you will still remember it. Thats why you did changes to that page, and you think that its so perfect now...
Besides, not everyone turns on their PC to check this forum, and even if they did, I dare to say that some people dont wanna post cause they feel that they dont have the right to post anything here...
And, you think only you have other interests?

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Originally posted by Devilin
And if somebody did complain to you, what would you do?  What have you done so far ? to address these serious issues ?,

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If Patchou didnt do anything to address the issues (bugs, and even C2Media) complained, would Messenger Plus developed to this state today with all these great features? Would so many people download it? NO. I dont think I am biased due to I am a great supporter of Messenger Plus, but, if Patchou didnt listen to the complains, people will NOT use it anymore.

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Originally posted by Devilin
I wish I had time to read every post in this forum, unfortunately I don't, although I have read some, my time is limited, perhaps a specific complaints page?  might resolve this

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Then whats the point of this forum? Isnt this something like a 'complain' page where people can post their problems here? If you really wanna to give your users that read your page with something useful, do your research first.
Didnt your teacher in any form of schooling teach you before, that you need to base your points with actual facts? You cant just assume it, just like you cant assume that an apple drops down a tree due to magical powers...
(I know the statement above is crappy, dont need to point it out)

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Originally posted by Devilin
My page will not be used as a platform, for saying, the messenger plus and C2, are easily uninstall,---  although they can be, they can also be extremely difficult to uninstall, they can cause serious problems and misery to the messenger plus user ,

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Okay, if you dont want to use your page as a platform for saying that they are easily uninstalled, then dont! Nobody is forcing you in anyway to do that...
Another thing, why do you say that it can be extremely difficult to uninstall? If its so difficult to uninstall, then why are the steps stated in your website so easy to uninstall Messenger Plus?
Btw, I see that you are using either a Windows 98 or Windows ME PC right? But hey, many of us are on Windows XP now!
Just like what you said, from a beginner's point of view, he might not know what to do, since your screenshots are taken differently from his. If you really want to make it so easy, then, make it cross OS compatible!

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Originally posted by Devilin
Although I sure you'd like me to insert the entire facts page, in the title, it isn't possible , unless you can conceive of a alternative title, but as I stated, I'm not a platform to distance one program from another

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NOBODY asked you to add the entire facts page in the title. I read all the forum pages, right to those which are not relevant, but, nothing has said to ask you to write the entire facts page in the title. Wouldnt it be foolish to think of that? Anyone with some common sense would know that it is quite impossible to some point to add the entire facts page in the title.
You dont need to be a platform to distance one program from another, but, what we just want from you is that you present something that is really useful to the users, not like the hack slash way you created your website (more on that later) and gives us the impression that you are creating something that helps people. It actually confuses them.

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Originally posted by Devilin
The same statement could also be applied to the glass is Half fall, the glass contains 50% liquid, the liquid is surrounded by 50 percent more glass, etc. etc. etc. all are valid depending upon your point of view,

CookieRevised, there are no facts, on a fundamental level, nothing can be proved or disapproved, apart from I think therefore I exist, but even that is open to interpretation, even the basis, of one of the most fundamental laws, e=mc squared, energy = mass squared by the speed of light, C. standing for the speed of light, the only universal Constant,  isn't entirely accurate the speed of light isn't constant, its affected by gravity, and some other stuff, which I won't go into

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Hey, whats the point of putting all these things there? Show us that your science is wonderful? We dont need that, even if it is to give us a hidden meaning of it.

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Originally posted by Devilin
CookieRevised, slow down, calm down and try to keep a Open mind about this, and try to perceive this, from the point of view, of somebody whom knows little about computers, has ended up in trouble, and has ended up on my page, because they were pointed there by a help forum

Taking this into consideration, if you can think of a better title, please let me no,------- as I previously stated, I cannot double line, because it would conflict with the background  choose knowledge image, and I don't wish to alter the text size and lose continuity with the other pages

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Hey, maybe its you that didnt keep an open mind about it. Btw, you forgot to use 'an' instead of 'a' there. Keep in mind about your english, although mine is not perfect.
If you are really serious about putting screenshots, just like what I said earlier, use a interface thats more common nowdays. If Microsoft released Windows XP, and many people have adopted to use it, they will show product features on their website (for example) designed for Windows XP, and not for other versions of Windows.
I am trying to say that, in this time, use something that is more common. Just check the advertisments. I dont know for you, but for me, in Singapore, the advertisments for computers includes a bundle of softwares, and it will include a version of Windows. All the advertisments now are promoting Windows XP, so you can see that many people have already adopted it.
Just one sentence: If its for a beginner, how would he uninstall if he sees that it is different from his computer?

As for the hack slash way you created your website. I know that mostly, if not all, web developers want their page to be consistant. But, you can change in a way that you can include a longer title without losing consistancy. I didnt edit your site, and thats the last thing I want to do, but, as I can observe, changing it wont harm anything, unless you show us concrete evidence, like maybe putting a page up on your server that shows the changes, exclusively for us people here.
If you cant show some evidence, whats the point of saying it?

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Originally posted by Sam Spade
You are incorrect.  An " / " does not equate with an " = ".

On the page in question, the separator can be read to be simply an abbreviation (replacement) for the word "and" or "or", or even better "and/or". 

Going on your assessment of the separator, the meaning of very common phraseology and/or would be 'and = or".  This is incorrect.

Consider this grammatical form of multiple choice that I have seen on various forms over time.

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Where did you get this information from? Just from what you assumed? Give something to back up your information, please.

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Originally posted by Devilin
I was asked to include the name C2 media

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Who asked you to do it? Shall I just quote everything from the forum here to show you that we didnt ask you to that?

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Originally posted by Devilin
I'm prepared to listen and adjust my page to any request, but I will not be used as a platform, to promote a one sided distorted point of view

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Adjust your page to any request? Stop kidding me man. Just asking you to explore alternative ways to change the title take so much time already, and you still say that you are prepared to listen? Please, we are tired of it already, dont we?

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Originally posted by Devilin
Not in IE , firefox, isn't the most popular browser --yet but good for you for using it, I'm still trying to overturn the Cross browser distortions 

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Hey, Mozilla is getting porpularity. If you dont create something that is cross browser fast, dont even think of having consistancy.
I dont really quite understand what you meant there, but just want to tell you, I used another PC to test out with a 800X600 resolution, and its double line. And, I used IE, not Mozilla, Firefox, or Netscape. Simply, any computer with a 800X600 resolution will see that it is double line, so, you are not consistant in any way, if it is viewed with a 800X600 resolution.

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Originally posted by Devilin
I'm sorry you feel that way, obviously the page isn't pro messenger plus enough for you, even though it suggests you can use messenger plus, without the sponsor at the bottom of the page, ------ which in a way is good, I didn't wish to write a pro messenger plus page, I didn't wish to write a anti messenger plus page, its also been suggested, from the anti brigade, that the page is far to pro, I'm happy to have reached a point, where you don't both like it equally,  mine is the beginners point of view, one that just doesn't care, that just wants a solution to a problem, not propaganda from either side

And I'm sure if your facts page, is entirely correct, nobody will ever have any problems, uninstall messenger plus or its sponsor program, nobody will ever need assistance on other help forms, so logically nobody will ever see my page, a lot of fuss over nothing wouldn't you say

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Who needs a page that is give so many pros of Messenger Plus when someone wants to just uninstall Messenger Plus? You know, people look for pages like yours because they dont trust Messenger Plus anymore, so they dont look for a page teaching how to uninstall on the main page of Messenger Plus (http://www.msgplus.net). They want something that is useful to them, so they look for pages like yours. But, you give them some things that are not true, and in some cases, it is not useful. Not at all when it is not my OS. Btw, whats the link Washington State Office of the Attorney General for? For those people who want to sue Patchou for Messenger Plus that includes a sponser?

Please answer my questions, no matter how rude I am, before you go around accusing Patchou again.

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Spam: Any post that is off-topic or contributes nothing useful or interesting to a thread is considered to be spam. Most spam posts will be moved or deleted. Spam includes posts that:

    * only contain emoticons.
    * only contain a short message, such as "LOL" or "hello."
    * are posted more than once, or immediately after another one of your   posts (double post). There is an edit button. Learn to use it.

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Oh, just before I forget to say, do you know that double posting is not allowed? You see the rules (http://shoutbox.menthix.net/rules.html), it clearly states that double posting is not allowed, instead, use the Edit button. Maybe I dont have the right to point that out to you, cause I am not a mod, but since nobody pointed it out, I will.

Signed,
f1d0d1d08989

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Originally posted by Devilin
Not in IE , firefox, isn't the most popular browser --yet but good for you for using it, I'm still trying to overturn the Cross browser distortions 

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im not using firefox i hope thats not the way you get the "facts" for your page (guessing )
im using avant, which is almost the same as IE, so i opened your page in Internet Explorer and voilá
wanna see?

http://chrono.pluslite.com/800x600.jpg

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Originally posted by downloaders

Just wanted to say that i choose not to install anything else than the plus itself and my pc got full undesirable behaviours (Something was installed that i did not wanted to)
I will not install it anymore, because I don't know if it is possible to get only the app.
You should write in BIG letters, what the prog does exactly to our pc's and what behaviours will it create whitout us knowing how to disable them.
I'm not talking about the app itself, im talking about the litttle things that come whit it.

Don't believe anything I say, i'm a liar, but wooud apreciate an answer. Sorry for my english.

Devilin: Thanks for your page, gave me some information i didn't know about. My time is to precious to spend it reading small text.

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if you selected NOT to install the sponsor, nothing except Plus! will be installed . So if you got 'something' then
A) its not from Plus!, you got it from somewhere else, there are thousands of programs which will install "stuff" withouth your consent (not being Plus! one of them ).
B) you agreed to install the sponsor.