Shoutbox

After about an hour on the phone with the bozo's at MicroSlop tech support here's the skinny I've learned:


1) The click box in Windows Messenger "Allow Messenger to run in background" is NOT functional.  Everytime you restart your system it get's re-checked.

2) The Messenger Service is NOT Windows Messenger.  It's the service the OS uses to notify you of errors and other system messages.

3) The "Ask for remote assistance" menu item in MSN Messenger still requires Windows Messenger (in fact, as far as I can tell the MSN one does nothing -- can't get MicroSlop to comment on it as they don't support it).

4) Removing Windows Messenger completely using the rundll technique does cripple many other tools in the OS and in MSN Messenger.

5)  GPEdit or a Registry Edit is the only way to disable Windows Messenger.  Merely, "uninstalling" it using "Add/Remove Programs" doesn't do anything but remove the icon from your start menu.

6) To use other tools which require windows messenger, such as remote assistance, the only way is to go back in with either gpedit or regedit and temporarily re-enable it.

Think that's about it.  Hope it helps.  Personally I don't like "work arounds", I prefer software that works.

Perhaps if enough of us bombard Microslop with emails about how much of a security risk it is to notify the world everytime you start up your computer, perhaps under their "Secure Computing Initiative" they might feel it would be bad PR not to action it. 

You can also write an email to your favourite anti-Microslop journalist suggesting they look into the security implications, this might also pressure MS to do something about it.  History has shown they could care less what the users want, but they do care how they appear in the press.

Can you take a video of you ripping your hair out? It could be funny

Everytime I started Outlook Express, Windows Messenger would start - then close itself. I just switched to using Outlook, which seems nicer anyway. Plus the calendar remembers stuff for me.

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Originally posted by Chris.
Everytime I started Outlook Express, Windows Messenger would start - then close itself. I just switched to using Outlook, which seems nicer anyway. Plus the calendar remembers stuff for me.

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Thats because Outlook Express and Windows Messenger are partially integrated

code:

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[Start] [Run] [Regedit]
Registry Key: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Outlook Express
Modify/Create the Value Name according to the Value Data listed below.
Data Type: REG_DWORD [Dword Value] // Value Name: Hide Messenger
Value Data: [2 = Messenger Will Not Load]
Exit Registry and Reboot

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do the above registry hack to prevent it from loading

i had that problem..ive disabled with some programs..but it would run anyway with Msn messenger..so ive renamed the exe file from msmsgs.exe to msmsgs.bak.and it doesnt run anymore anyway..msn messenger works fine now

quote:

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Originally posted by M_Cheevy
After about an hour on the phone with the bozo's at MicroSlop tech support here's the skinny I've learned:

1) The click box in Windows Messenger "Allow Messenger to run in background" is NOT functional.  Everytime you restart your system it get's re-checked.

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It is functional. Messenger Plus! is the cause that it is rechecked each time. Without Messenger Plus! running you can check/uncheck it at your own choice.

quote:

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Originally posted by M_Cheevy
2) The Messenger Service is NOT Windows Messenger.  It's the service the OS uses to notify you of errors and other system messages.

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We could've told you that This service can be disabled to prevent spam-popups from outside.

About this Messenger Service:
Transmits net send and Alerter service messages between clients and servers.

BlackViper.com adds this:
This service provides the ability to send messages between clients and servers. This service needs not to be running under normal home conditions. It is also advisable to make this service go away to avoid the possibility of 'net send' messages hitting your computer from the internet. This has nothing to do with MSN Messenger, nor is it WinPopUp. To test for this security vulnerability, at the command prompt, (run: cmd.exe) type: net send 127.0.0.1 hi. If you get a popup 'hi' message, you should disable the Messenger service. If you get an error stating, 'The message alias could not be found on the network,' you are safe. If, for whatever reason, you need the Messenger service running but wish not to have spam popups active, you can disable the particular ports at your firewall. The Messenger service uses UDP ports 135, 137, and 138; TCP ports 135, 139, and 445.

quote:

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Originally posted by M_Cheevy
3) The "Ask for remote assistance" menu item in MSN Messenger still requires Windows Messenger (in fact, as far as I can tell the MSN one does nothing -- can't get MicroSlop to comment on it as they don't support it).

4) Removing Windows Messenger completely using the rundll technique does cripple many other tools in the OS and in MSN Messenger.

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We could've told you that MSN Messenger uses the Windows Messenger API for some of its features like Remote Desktop, Whiteboard, etc... If you removed or disabled Windows Messenger, those features will not work anymore in MSN Messenger. Also, some plugins need the Windows Messenger API. So, in short disabling/removing Windows Messenger is a bad idea... Microsoft does support it, because it is a MSN/Microsoft thing Of course if you said that you removed or disabled Windows Messenger, I think that they will say something like: "we do not answer questions if you altered something in Microsoft products or altered the way they work"...

quote:

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Originally posted by M_Cheevy
5)  GPEdit or a Registry Edit is the only way to disable Windows Messenger.  Merely, "uninstalling" it using "Add/Remove Programs" doesn't do anything but remove the icon from your start menu.

6) To use other tools which require windows messenger, such as remote assistance, the only way is to go back in with either gpedit or regedit and temporarily re-enable it.

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Indeed, uninstalling only removes the icon, it will not remove the program itself (for the above reasons).

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So....

First of all DO NOT remove, nor disable Windows Messenger to solve these issues. You will cripple more things then you know:

Do not use:

* "RunDll32 advpack.dll,LaunchINFSection %windir%\INF\msmsgs.inf,BLC.Remove"-method
* "HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Policies\Microsoft\Messenger\Client\PreventRun=1"-method
* "HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Policies\Microsoft\Messenger\Client\PreventAutoRun=1"-method
* "GPEDIT.MSC"-method
* "renaming msmsgs.exe"-method
* "MessengerDisable.exe > Disable Windows Messenger"-method
as these methods will cripple other parts of the OS; MSN Messenger and some Plus!-plugins will not work 100% anymore (Remote Assistance, Whiteboard, Application Sharing, Song2Nick-plugin, etc...)

* "editing sysoc.inf"-method
* "Start->All Programs->Accessories->System Tools->Disk Cleanup"-method
as these methods will only remove the icon from the start menu and doesn't do a thing in preventing the startup of Windows Messenger...

* "Control Panel->User Accounts"-method
as this will cripple other things in your OS and/or MSN accounts...

* Use your firewall to block access to the net with Windows Messenger.
Although it wouldn't sign in anymore, Windows Messenger will still be started up in the background and try to connect.


Correct way:

note: If you uninstalled Windows Messenger previously, then you need to install it again first...

1) Close every instance of Outlook and Outlook Express.
This step is needed to make sure that nothing interfears with the procedure and to make sure the following steps can be performed.

2) Open Norton AntiVirus. Go to the options and click on Instant Messaging. At the bottom, uncheck "Scan incomming messages and files". Close Norton AntiVirus.
This option is btw useless as you can scan every incoming file by setting the scan-option in Messenger itself and also virusses don't get spread in text.

3) Close every instance of MSN Messenger, Windows Messenger and Messenger Plus!. Do this by opening your Task Manager (by pressing CTRL-ALT-DEL). Now find every instance of msnmsgr.exe, msmsgs.exe and msgplus.exe and press the "End Process"-button.
This step is needed to make sure that nothing interfears with the procedure and to make sure the following steps can be performed.

4) Open MessengerDisable and uncheck every box. Press Apply. Close MessengerDisable again.
This step is needed to enable Windows Messenger again and to make sure the following steps (5 and 6) can be performed.

5) Open Windows Messenger and go to Tools > Options > Preferences. uncheck "Run Windows Messenger when Windows starts" and uncheck "Allow Windows Messenger to run in the background". Close Windows Messenger again. Note: if the second option is greyed out, that means that Messenger Plus! is still running, in that case proceed to step 3...

6a) Open Outlook Express and go to Tools > Options > General. uncheck "Automatically log on to Windows Messenger". Close Outlook Express.

6b) Open Outlook and go to Tools > Options > Other. uncheck "Enable Instant Messaging in Microsoft Outlook". Close Outlook.

7) Open MessengerDisable and check "Hide Messenger from Outlook Express", do not check any other option like "disable". Now, press Apply. Close MessengerDisable again.
Note: this will do more then setting the value of HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Outlook Express\Hide Messenger to 2 as some might think.

8) Open Registry Editor and navigate to the following keys and delete every occurence of Windows Messenger, msmsgs.exe and/or MSMSGS in:
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Run
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunOnce
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunOnceEx
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunServices
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunServicesOnce
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Run
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunOnce
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunOnceEx
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunServices
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\RunServicesOnce
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Windows\Run
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Windows\Load

If you are not comfortable with editing the registry directly then you can use a program like AutoRuns (execute from browser here) to check the above keys.
Do not use "msconfig.exe" as this will not show you every possible key that can hold something that is starting up when Windows starts and because it can only temporarly disable things.

9) Check your "StartUp"-folder in your start-menu to make sure Windows Messenger isn't listed there. If it is listed there, then delete it. Note: even if you don't see a "StartUp"-folder, you will still have one; The EXACT location can be obtained from the registry:
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Shell Folders\Startup
and
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Shell Folders\Common Startup


10) If everything is done, reboot your computer...



This seems a lot to do and many will say "I did this and that and it works". But note that this method is for ALL users regardless which OS they have (Home or Pro) or how they have set up Windows.

This method will also make sure that the API of Windows Messenger can still be used. From now on Windows Messenger will only be started whenever you want it or when the API's are explicitly needed (but it will not sign in anymore) and it will NOT startup in the background and/or automaticly when you logon to Windows, nor when you open Outlook (Express).

Also note that this method DOES work, but you must follow the instructions exactly!

PS: Windows Messenger is NOT the same as Messenger Services, nor the same as MSN Messenger, nor the same as Windows Live Messenger.

CookieRevised, thanx very much for that
worked very well, haven't had a problem since!

Thankyou!

HEY this method didn't work with ADP installed on my computer

any Ideas
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Wow 3 year old posts are funny to re-read , heh

there is one more reason for windows messenger starting up that i havent seen... this is if your using Norton... Norton antivirus will cause windows messenger to start and log you on automatically and never display an icon on the taskbar  i figured this out awhile back when my sisters were having the problem... open norton antivirus go to options click on instant messaging and at the bottom there should be an option checked to scan incomming messages and files on windows messenger 4.7 or 5.0 uncheck the option and windows messenger shouldnt start up or log you on.