I came across this on another forum. I was just wondering what everyone thought.

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Im not a conspiracy theorist or anything like that, and i am highly skeptical of this, but i simply cant shrug this off for some reason.

This is a video filmed by a guy who were at the crash scene right after it happened (you can see the flames). You can see several unknown people walk around in the area, and people SUPPOSEDLY yelling "Dont kill us" etc in Polish, in which after you hear multiple gunshots (or something else, i dont know) all while a siren is blowing to maybe cover up the sounds. Now, like most people, i would discard this as crazy conspiracy theorist bullshit, but then:

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Author of the video seen by everyone by now has been stabbed near Kijow on 4.15 and transported in critical condition to the hospital in Kijow.

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But i still thought "hm...nahh its just a coincidence". But then:

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On 4.16 three unidentified individuals unplugged him from life support system and stabbed him 3 more times. Andrij was pronounced dead that afternoon. Russian government claims it was a coincidence

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So now i dont know what to think. What about you guys? The polish president is known for opposing the Lisabon Treaty and similar things. Also, Putin himself is in charge of the investigation.

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Imo, I think it could quite possibly be pilot error given the weather conditions, but the only question I have is: "Why is the pilot so stubborn?"

You've got a plane-load of VeryVeryVIPs, and try landing at the same airport 5 times without switch airports with considerably better facilities?

Unclipped video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7yD_SVK7Yw

Aerial Picture of crash site: http://bi.gazeta.pl/im/3/7765/m7765863.jpg

From the aerial picture, seems quite probable that someone can catch it on film. Keep in mind that a presidential aircraft would look like any other aircraft to someone that is unfamiliar.

(Oh, and the gunshots could be the emergency oxygen tanks exploding.)

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Originally posted by Nagamasa
Imo, I think it could quite possibly be pilot error given the weather conditions, but the only question I have is: "Why is the pilot so stubborn?"

You've got a plane-load of VeryVeryVIPs, and try landing at the same airport 5 times without switch airports with considerably better facilities?

Unclipped video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7yD_SVK7Yw

Aerial Picture of crash site: http://bi.gazeta.pl/im/3/7765/m7765863.jpg

From the aerial picture, seems quite probable that someone can catch it on film. Keep in mind that a presidential aircraft would look like any other aircraft to someone that is unfamiliar.

(Oh, and the gunshots could be the emergency oxygen tanks exploding.)

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This reminds me of the X-Files message: "I want to believe".  Conspiracy theorists want to believe their theories.  That does not make them true.

When I was much younger, I started out asking myself "why do people do the things they do?"  Having turned older (and hopefully wiser), I now understand that a much better question to ask is the approximate reverse, "what purpose does this action serve and whom does it benefit?"  The answer to the latter is also the answer to the former.

Looking at it that way, there is little reason to believe any conspiracy surrounding the Polish president's plane crash.  While staging it might not be beyond the abilities of the Russian special forces, there is no conceivable reason for them to do it.  Powers of significant influence don't do stupid things because they can, they do what they do for a reason.  Therefore, I don't believe the Russians did anything to contribute to or cause this.

What it sounds like is a pilot error, perhaps a pilot error under pressure.  The Polish president had a prior reputation for interfering with his flight crew's decisions, which puts them in a very difficult situation.  What do you do when you know this is unsafe, but your country's president won't hear of it and wants you to put his plane down in bad weather?

Edit: Also, it should be noted that Kiev is not anywhere close to Smolensk where the crash occurred, and it is in Ukraine, not Russia.

I am not saying this is 100% true, but tbh it looks like it is true. There is so many unanswered questions about the video and no one has proved it's a fake yet.

The video of the crash site looks legit, Images of the video can be exactly matched to official photos taken by the press.

Also they say there is no survivors, yet you can clearly see people jumping out of the wreckage and then you can hear people in polish saying "please don't kill me" then gun shots.

It just all seems so dodgy and i haven't found one person that somehow discredited the video.
(Is the video fake? Is the polish in the video actually saying "please dont kill me")

So i am interested in seeing what everyone else thinks.

P.S also the guy who shot the video was murdered, which makes it all even more dodgier.

Well, first of all, why would the Russians want to murder everyone on the Polish plane?

Second, I think there is little doubt that the plane actually crashed - or is anyone trying to say it got shot down?

Third, I find it very very unlikely that anyone can survive a crash like that, yet alone "jumping out of the wreckage".

Fourth, I actually (quickly) watched the video. I didn't see anyone there, at all?

As for why the pilot tired to land so many times, I've heard some story about the same president firing another pilot when he followed the orders of air traffic control. The president supposedly told him to follow the original flight plan anyway.

And finally, it's a video on the internet.

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Originally posted by Discrate
(Is the video fake? Is the polish in the video actually saying "please dont kill me")

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And the source who said the guy was killed? How reliable is it?

Power of suggestion someone?

All I can think of when seeing that movie (and the extremely poor quality, so poor you can hardly see anything at all), is that it is the same as all those so called proof of ghosts photographs and so called subliminal messages in backwards music and what not.

When someone says you'll see this and that (or you hear this and that) and you show them a blurry photo 75% of people will actually see the thing which is said to be there, eventhough it isn't there at all....

Conspiracy theorists will have a field day with this one though... I rather wait for the "Seconds from disaster" docu on NGC...lol.

PS: I even hear a horse (police horse?) at some point (1:37).... Then again, to keep in the same conspiracy trend: it can be the dead scream from a little girl who is stabbed with a knife too.


PSS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_-oWN4a8uY&NR=1
those comments from ModderZ7 paint a very different (far more believable) picture

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
it can be the dead scream from a little girl who is stabbed with a knife too.

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1. SUPPOSEDLY yelling "Don't kill us" etc in Polish. - Ask another polish person, they'll give you a different translation.
2. Gunshots. - Something exploding, fuel?
3. Siren covering sounds. - Siren from what, they're normally around accidents...
4. Author of the video stabbed, hospitalized, stabbed again. - N source
5. What's there to see in the two photos?

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Originally posted by zach
1. SUPPOSEDLY yelling "Don't kill us" etc in Polish. - Ask another polish person, they'll give you a different translation.

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Originally posted by zach
5. What's there to see in the two photos?

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So what does the polish shouts actually say?

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Originally posted by Discrate
Read more: http://gazbom.blogspot.com/2010/04/guy-who-filmed...html#ixzz0lnx7WBy2

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Originally posted by Adeptus
Edit: Also, it should be noted that Kiev is not anywhere close to Smolensk where the crash occurred, and it is in Ukraine, not Russia.

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Originally posted by wacky
I just checked on google map and there is a train track pretty near by. So the 'siren' is quite likely to have been the train

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Originally posted by zach
2. Gunshots. - Something exploding, fuel?

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