Shoutbox

In the case of the texts used, I must agree, I also found that the current English texts (especially the "don't agree"-text) was/is a bit dodgy. I've used the following text for the two buttons in the Dutch translation:

SponsorAccept=Ik ga AKKOORD, installeer Messenger Plus! MET sponsor.
SponsorRefuse=Ik ga NIET AKKOORD, installeer Messenger Plus! ZONDER sponsor.

in English this would be:
SponsorAccept=I ACCEPT, install Messenger Plus! WITH the sponsor program.
SponsorRefuse=I REFUSE, install Messenger Plus! WITHOUT the sponsor program.

Even if 1000000 people installed the sponsor by accident, then they still didn't read what they're installing. It is made very clear (even in the eyes of a n00b) that it is about a sponsor.

I did some poll/test a while ago (thread somewhere on the forum here) and repeated it months later with +100 people. I compared the results and behold:
the people who accidently install the sponsor aren't the complete n00bs (those people read everything like they should), but the people who "think" they know computers and also the "more experienced" users. Both these type of people didn't think it would be nessecairy to read something, because they supposed they know what it says/does anyway... (indeed some even claimed and sweared that they never saw something like "sponsor agreement", while I was there looking behind there shoulder to see what and how they installed it...)
Then the "very experienced" people do read the agreement, because they know they need to "read" such things.

(PS: by reading I don't mean word for word, but a quick diagonal look; You don't have to read the complete text to know it is about a sponsor. Just a quick look at the title is enough: "Sponsor Agreement" and not "License Agreement")

I think some people still don't get it.

I'm saying that if the screen is changed so that it isn't techie and more clear, "Hey, you don't have to install this" (I like the WITH and WITHOUT method, very clear, GOOGLE also has one "Read this, it isn't the usual mumbo-jumbo" or something like that") more people are going to keep and reccommend Plus! which means more Plus! users.

If if most Plus! users allowed even SOME ads, I'm sure that would drastically increase the ad volume. I'll bet that most of us here don't have the ad thingy installed, because we can't turn it off. Sure, turn it on full blast at night, let a few in turing the day, as long as I can control it. Also, it might still be appropriate and professional to ask them to install WITH the sponsor under the clear understanding that it is easy to turn off and they will be in control. I have seen programs that ask you to install it to support them.

The point ladies and gents, is marketing: Make the sponsor not annoying, easy to get rid of if you don't want it (not a full un-install), and easy to adjust so that they will be comfortable with it. The point of good marketing is more money. Unless Patchou's argreement with the sponsor won't allow such changes or unless the sponsor is only ever going to pay a fixed amount, it is a good idea. Even if the sponsor was going to be like that, it makes sense to do, because eventually, someone else would be willing to pay more than the current sponsor for so much willing ad space.



~The Entomologist

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
In the case of the texts used, I must agree, I also found that the current English texts (especially the "don't agree"-text) was/is a bit dodgy. I've used the following text for the two buttons in the Dutch translation:

SponsorAccept=Ik ga AKKOORD, installeer Messenger Plus! MET sponsor.
SponsorRefuse=Ik ga NIET AKKOORD, installeer Messenger Plus! ZONDER sponsor.

in English this would be:
SponsorAccept=I ACCEPT, install Messenger Plus! WITH the sponsor program.
SponsorRefuse=I REFUSE, install Messenger Plus! WITHOUT the sponsor program.

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Yes... well... as tempting as it may be to change the text of the radio buttons to make it more understandable, you must keep in mind that your job as a translator is solely to translate the English text, not to modify it so that users interpret it differently from the original meaning. I do believe that Patchou has underlined this on several occasions. In the end, your modification can (and does) prevent users from installing the sponsor who otherwise would have, and as translators we don't really have the right to do that - don't you agree?

Personally I do, of course, prefer your choice of word - or even better:

*Install Messenger Plus! WITH the sponsor.
*Install Messenger Plus! WITHOUT the sponsor.

This would be very difficult for the users to misunderstand, but it would obviously cause less money to roll in as a result of fewer people installing the sponsor.


//ZrednaZ

(Sorry Entomologist, I know this was a bit off-topic. Btw, I agree on your post above this one...)

Hum...... CookieRevised..... the sponsor part of the installer is very special and I really want all translators not to change ny word of this screen... in fact, that's why I added this comment in the english file:

;This text is for the sponsor window. Please translate it carefully, without changing its meaning, adding or removing information

I know you didn't had any bad intentions, but you have to understand that I can't allow every translator to use the mix he wants, else, I'll end up with
     "Do not click here!!!"
     "Install Messenger Plus!, click here"

I'm counting on you to change it back during the Plus!3 translation phase.

Thanks,
Patchou

quote:

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Originally posted by ZrednaZ
In the end, your modification can (and does) prevent users from installing the sponsor who otherwise would have, and as translators we don't really have the right to do that - don't you agree?

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I agree, but I didn't alter the meaning of the text. And if users generate more money by clicking on "accept" instead of "refuse", it is only because they thought by clicking on "refuse" they couldn't install plus!. While they only wanted install plus without the sponsor. (I'm only talking about the people who do want plus without the sponsor; the other people wont be affected by the "change"). And is it better to "force" an unwanted sponsor then making it (more) clear they can install plus without? (PS: yes I know, they should read an try and etc... etc...)

I did put A LOT of thought before "altering" it a bit, be sure of that. It wasn't a light/quick decission...... But in the end I forgot to ask permission and explain myself...

quote:

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Originally posted by ZrednaZ
Personally I do, of course, prefer your choice of word - or even better:
*Install Messenger Plus! WITH the sponsor.
*Install Messenger Plus! WITHOUT the sponsor.

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That's even worse, cause you don't state clearly that you do/don't agree with the agreement...

quote:

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Originally posted by Patchou
I'm counting on you to change it back during the Plus!3 translation phase.

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I'll certainly do that...

Although IMO, I didn't alter it's true meaning by adding the "Messenger Plus!" part in the refuse-button. But I understand why the refuse-button should be lowercased.

I'll email you regarding this...

I understand the arguments, however, you have to know that I have some obligations with C2Media and there's already way much more protections in the setup than in any other software they sponsorise. I obviously do not want to force the adware on anyone's computer and the current text is not designed to fool anyone. Accept is the onlyone in uppercase to make sure that people read what they accept. If I put Refuse uppercased too, then they probably won't care as much, I guess it's a matter of opinion .

Thank you for your understanding . Btw, I checked the original posts (thanks WDZ) and I'm happy to see that they are old posts from the time the sponsor had been introduced.

For those who want to know, since the beginning of this year, I have more users than I had last June. When the sponsor was introduced, I lost about 35% of my users in two monthes (yeah, that's depressing) but in the months that followed, users came back (I guess some of them realised that everything you read on the net about someone/something is not always true). So, everythign is fine, everyone is happy, and this forum is very very helpful (as long as people don't flame each other).

Also, if you're interested to knwo how many users install the sponsor, I'm currently at a rate of 60% so almost half of my users chose not to install the adware. With around 50,000 install per day, it's a lot of people who continue to enjoy Plus! without any downside whatsoever, which proves that the current acceptance screen and the many posts on the web about it are useful and working . I hope you see why I'm not searching to change this part of the setup anymore .

i think you should maybe change. I ACCEPT, install sponsor
and                                                I REJECT, dont install sponsor
to: install plus: WITH sponsor
                         WITHOUT sponsor(recommended)

hehe... the "(recommended)"-thing would be like dreaming but I guess it would be hard to convince C2Media that it is a great sollution

// Kian
Danish Trans(lator)

quote:

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Originally posted by Pappapishu
to: install plus: WITH sponsor
                         WITHOUT sponsor(recommended)

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kian
hehe... the "(recommended)"-thing would be like dreaming but I guess it would be hard to convince C2Media that it is a great sollution

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Ermmm, why would you "recommend" it? Both are safe. There is no "best" option. If there should be any "recommended" option it should be WITH the sponsor. Because, if nobody installs it anymore, Patchou won't get any money anymore, and he needs an income, like anyone else. So then he should work full-time, meaning no time to develop plus! anymore... And the choice should be with the user...

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
But I understand why the refuse-button should be lowercased.

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and

quote:

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Originally posted by Patchou
Accept is the onlyone in uppercase to make sure that people read what they accept. If I put Refuse uppercased too, then they probably won't care as much, I guess it's a matter of opinion .

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maybe it's safe and so, i'm not saying anything against it, but people usually dont't like it!