Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? - Printable Version
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Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by riahc4 on 01-06-2010 at 06:43 PM
Hey
There was news today about Patchou posting on his personal blog about giving the software to the company.
I have to ask if you think Patchou has sold out. Normally all my polls are public, but in this case since most dont have the nuts to tell Patchou the truth and lie to look good, Ill make the votes private.
So there it is: Do you think Patchou sold out?
My reply: No.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-06-2010 at 07:13 PM
* toddy has no idea what you're on about
maybe u should provide a link
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by robert_dll on 01-06-2010 at 07:17 PM
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-06-2010 at 07:29 PM
If he sold out he would have gone "screw you guys, I'm going home" and walk away with loads of money. Instead at the moment he's hiring developers and putting an office together in preparation for MP!L5. True though, with new owners above him which manage the business and can make their own decisions.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by andrey on 01-06-2010 at 07:30 PM
I don't see how launching your own company could be seen as selling out.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Spunky on 01-06-2010 at 07:30 PM
OT: That's 2 links so far that haven't parsed? Are you all using noparse tags today for some reason? 
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-06-2010 at 07:34 PM
quote:Odd. http://www.patchou.com/projects/msgplus/4/
Originally posted by Spunky
That's 2 links so far that haven't parsed?
The last part of that post is about Yuna and new owners, but the entire thing is a nice history read http://www.patchou.com/projects/msgplus/ (4 pages).
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Spunky on 01-06-2010 at 07:44 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Menthix
Odd
Silly me... May be because they both omitted the http section... I would have thought www.blah.com would have been recognized as a link though
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by robert_dll on 01-06-2010 at 09:21 PM
OK Link Fixed 
Menthix's links are better anyway 
In my opinion, this was something beneficial for the software. We will probably get updates more often and a better product with many new features.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-06-2010 at 09:25 PM
quote:That's paid or full of ads
Originally posted by robert_dll
OK Link Fixed
Menthix's links are better anyway
In my opinion, this was something beneficial for the software. We will probably get updates more often and a better product with many new features.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by prashker on 01-06-2010 at 09:34 PM
quote:
Originally posted by krissy-afc
quote:That's paid or full of ads
Originally posted by robert_dll
OK Link Fixed
Menthix's links are better anyway
In my opinion, this was something beneficial for the software. We will probably get updates more often and a better product with many new features.
I highly doubt it won't be optional.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Thor on 01-06-2010 at 09:36 PM
quote:I wholeheartedly agree with that. Looking at the current history and the fact that Patchou still is within Yuna Software, if this was to happen I would be extremely surprised.
Originally posted by SonicSam
quote:
Originally posted by krissy-afc
quote:That's paid or full of ads
Originally posted by robert_dll
OK Link Fixed
Menthix's links are better anyway
In my opinion, this was something beneficial for the software. We will probably get updates more often and a better product with many new features.
I highly doubt it won't be optional.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-06-2010 at 09:43 PM
Still could happen.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrono on 01-06-2010 at 09:45 PM
i do agree that it's unlikely that they force you to install the sponsor or start charging for the software, mostly because people would stop using Plus!. Trust me, they dont want that to happen
Nonetheless, im not sure if this whole thing is the best for the software, but we cant do much about it other than wait and see for ourselves.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Toxn on 01-06-2010 at 09:47 PM
Hmm charge us for the software... hmmm
Well... Pirate
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by prashker on 01-06-2010 at 09:52 PM
quote:There's been torrents before of it
Originally posted by Toxn
Hmm charge us for the software... hmmm
Well... Pirate
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by blackjack on 01-06-2010 at 10:24 PM
Whats the serial key for msgplus? lols
on a serious note...
i agree with Chromo 
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by robert_dll on 01-07-2010 at 12:20 AM
IREAL-LYDOU-BTYOU-WILLN-EEDAK-EY
Just wait to see what happens
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by riahc4 on 01-07-2010 at 12:29 AM
Well I didnt think that Yuna Software was going to make Messenger Plus! Live payware (?) or make the ads nonoptional but it is a choice.
I believe that Patchou is smart and has stated some clause when he gave this company his software.
BTW this company (Yuna Software) doesnt even have anything. Is this a different company or did Patchou make this company and now, as president/founder/etc, is hiring a staff/team/beta testers/devs/etc? Im not too sure on this.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by charlie_su1986 on 01-16-2010 at 06:54 PM
Patchou is not in charge of Messenger Plus anymore; whoever runs Yuna software is.
this is not my opnion, it's a fact.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-16-2010 at 08:01 PM
quote:which would be patchou (i think)
Originally posted by charlie_su1986
whoever runs Yuna software is
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-16-2010 at 08:07 PM
quote:Small correction: he does not own Plus! anymore, there is a small difference.
Originally posted by charlie_su1986
Patchou is not in charge of Messenger Plus anymore; whoever runs Yuna software is.
this is not my opnion, it's a fact.
He is still in charge of some aspects of it. Just as other people are now in charge for the other bits. Each having their own function. So it does not mean Patchou does not have anything to say anymore (hence this is no sell-out). His official title in the company is Software Architect.
quote:No, he does not run Yuna Software anymore. However, he is still actively involved in Yuna Software’s daily business.
Originally posted by toddy
quote:which would be patchou (i think)
Originally posted by charlie_su1986
whoever runs Yuna software is
At one point Yuna Software was created by Patchou (for legal reasons), and it was just him running the company. From that point on the company named Yuna Software owned Messenger Plus!, not the person called Patchou.
A few months ago, he has sold his company and now there are many more people involved in Plus!. Patchou isn't the only one anymore.
For some details see the linked posted by Menthix before:
http://www.patchou.com/2009/12/the-messenger-plus-story/
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by user27089 on 01-17-2010 at 12:40 AM
Just want to say that what MenthiX said about someone selling out is wrong. Just because someone is still partaking in something doesn't mean that they haven't sold out. It means that they've sold out on their core values, their initial reasons for doing something or even just going against their own beliefs.
I can't really comment on what Patchou has done, but I think he made a business decision that was, whether he's selling out or not, a good move. Something like Messenger Plus! is not going to last forever. If I were in Patchou's shoes and I had the opportunity of selling a thriving business for a good amount and still be involved I would go for it.
However, even though it may've been a solid business decision, that doesn't stop me from thinking that Patchou has sold out a little. I know someone like him who is so dedicated to the Messenger Plus! software could not live off the proceeds whilst keeping to his core beliefs, but he's still sold out. That's the reason why I couldn't bring myself to pressing the 'no' button in this poll.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
A few months ago, he has sold his company and now there are many more people involved in Plus!. Patchou isn't the only one anymore.
I'm sure that many other members will agree with me when I say that involving many more people in Messenger Plus! isn't a good thing. I think the main pull towards Plus! for a lot of us was that it was community-driven. I don't know anything about the employees of Messenger Plus! but I do know that they're doing what they're doing for monetary gain and as a job; their hearts will never be in it as much as if Patchou had passed the gauntlet down to x amount of trusted people in a community like this.
The 'community spirit' will slowly evaporate away.
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
He is still in charge of some aspects of it. Just as other people are now in charge for the other bits. Each having their own function. So it does not mean Patchou does not have anything to say anymore (hence this is no sell-out). His official title in the company is Software Architect.
Regardless of what you say. All this says to me is that he's not as personally attached to the software anymore. I don't blame him, but I think it seems like he's chasing other dreams now. A good choice.
Yuna Software is now in charge of Messenger Plus!. Whether Patchou is a 'software architect' or not, it will still no longer be down to him when it comes to financial decisions, cashflow and so on and so forth. If Yuna Software were to say tomorrow "Let's make people pay for the forum", I don't think there's much that could be done to stop them, the same as if they wanted to make adware no longer optional and make Plus! more ad-driven...
Patchou is not in control.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 12:46 AM
We don't pay for the software so we can't tell Patchou what to do.
He can listen but has no obligation to listen to us.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 01:42 AM
quote:I disagree...
Originally posted by traxor
I'm sure that many other members will agree with me when I say that involving many more people in Messenger Plus! isn't a good thing.
quote:That may all be very true, but the fact is also that the development of Plus! was as good as nothing over the past months/year. And that was just because it got so big it wasn't possible anymore for only one guy programming the thing (and managing everything else around it at the same time).
Originally posted by traxor
I think the main pull towards Plus! for a lot of us was that it was community-driven. I don't know anything about the employees of Messenger Plus! but I do know that they're doing what they're doing for monetary gain and as a job; their hearts will never be in it as much as if Patchou had passed the gauntlet down to x amount of trusted people in a community like this.
The 'community spirit' will slowly evaporate away.
Hence the reason why Patchou has made the move he made, for the benefit of Plus! itself. In that aspect, having multiple people working on Plus!, is a very good thing. If he wouldn't have done what he did then there would most-likely never be a Plus! 5 btw.
(I'm not saying anything about the reason why those 'other' people want to work for it though)...
quote:That is both true and false...
Originally posted by traxor
Regardless of what you say. All this says to me is that he's not as personally attached to the software anymore. I don't blame him, but I think it seems like he's chasing other dreams now. A good choice.
He is personally still attached to the software in the way that he still cares about it. But he is not personally attached anymore in a legal way. So if something went wrong, you need to blame Yuna Software, not Patchou.
quote:Partially wrong. Yuna Software has no say what-so-ever about the forums (Patchou made sure of that). They do own the domain though, but not the forum itself, nor its content. Also, Patchou has stipulated some things in the contracts which prevents Yuna Software from going 'overboard'.
Originally posted by traxor
If Yuna Software were to say tomorrow "Let's make people pay for the forum", I don't think there's much that could be done to stop them, the same as if they wanted to make adware no longer optional and make Plus! more ad-driven...
Again, all reasons that this is not a sell-out at all. A sell-out would mean that they can do whatever they want. They sure can not.
And also shows that one-liners like "Patchou is in no control" or "He doesn't own Plus! anymore" can seriously be misinterpreted. It isn't that black 'n white.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 01:53 AM
I think he sold out tbh.
The focus of plus now will be "make as much money possible"
Anyway, where is the news post telling us what has happened? or weren't we suppose to find out? Is this all suppose to be hush hush?
P.S This is funny, a couple of years ago they had an april fools joke about this.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 02:00 AM
quote:very true, but even if we would pay for it, then we still couldn't tell what they need to do! Even in that case, we are still not the owners or CEOs or whatever who call the shots and tell the programmers what to program. You always pay for an existing version of software and thus for the stuff they have done (eventhough you might not be satisfied with it).
Originally posted by krissy-afc
We don't pay for the software so we can't tell Patchou what to do.
He can listen but has no obligation to listen to us.
Software is not to be confused with a service where there is a contract between you and those who want to service you in which it is explicitly stated what the service must be. Only in that case you can tell them what you want. With software this is not the case.
quote:There is absolutely nothing hush hush about it, the changes are not that noticable but are there for everybody to see. (eg: copyright notices, forum and website footers that all changed from 'Patchou' to 'Yuna Software Inc', the about box in Plus!, some of Patchou's post talking about it, etc).
Originally posted by Discrate
Anyway, where is the news post telling us what has happened? or weren't we suppose to find out? Is this all suppose to be hush hush?
Nevertheless everybody should know about the change. To get a bit up to speed read Patchou's blog for example. He also had announced the upcoming change months ago (though not officially in a news post, but in one of his posts on these forums iirc).
EDIT: Made a bit clear because some people misinterpreted what I said.
And Discrate, iirc is not irc. IIRC is extremely common internet jargon for "if I recall/remember correctly".
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 02:08 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:very true, but even if we would pay for it, then we still couldn't tell what they need to do! Even in that case, we are still not the owners or CEOs or whatever who call the shots and tell the programmers what to program. You always pay for an existing version of software and thus for the stuff they have done (eventhough you might not be satisfied with it).
Originally posted by krissy-afc
We don't pay for the software so we can't tell Patchou what to do.
He can listen but has no obligation to listen to us.
Software is not to be confused with a service where there is a contract between you and those who want to service you in which it is explicitly stated what the service must be. Only in that case you can tell them what you want. With software this is not the case.
quote:There is absolutely nothing hush hush about it. In fact, everybody should know the change. Read Patchou's blog for example. He also had announced the change months ago (though not officially in a news post, but in one of his posts on this forums iirc).
Originally posted by Discrate
Anyway, where is the news post telling us what has happened? or weren't we suppose to find out? Is this all suppose to be hush hush?
Well i only just found out about this by reading andrey and WDZ talkign about it in the shoutbox.
I think a post in the announcement section needs to be made. Not everyone knows about patchous blog and irc.Also i have been reading other forum posts such as willz on his forum. He also said that many people were left in the dark. An official forum post needs to be made asap, i would like to know what the capitalist have in store for us.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 02:33 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:very true, but even if we would pay for it, then we still couldn't tell what they need to do! Even in that case, we are still not the owners or CEOs or whatever who call the shots and tell the programmers what to program. You always pay for an existing version of software and thus for the stuff they have done (eventhough you might not be satisfied with it).
Originally posted by krissy-afc
We don't pay for the software so we can't tell Patchou what to do.
He can listen but has no obligation to listen to us.
Software is not to be confused with a service where there is a contract between you and those who want to service you in which it is explicitly stated what the service must be. Only in that case you can tell them what you want. With software this is not the case.
quote:There is absolutely nothing hush hush about it. In fact, everybody should know about the change. Read Patchou's blog for example. He also had announced the change months ago (though not officially in a news post, but in one of his posts on these forums iirc).
Originally posted by Discrate
Anyway, where is the news post telling us what has happened? or weren't we suppose to find out? Is this all suppose to be hush hush?
Yeah well it could be a service to use the program
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:very true, but even if we would pay for it, then we still couldn't tell what they need to do! Even in that case, we are still not the owners or CEOs or whatever who call the shots and tell the programmers what to program. You always pay for an existing version of software and thus for the stuff they have done (eventhough you might not be satisfied with it).
Originally posted by krissy-afc
We don't pay for the software so we can't tell Patchou what to do.
He can listen but has no obligation to listen to us.
Software is not to be confused with a service where there is a contract between you and those who want to service you in which it is explicitly stated what the service must be. Only in that case you can tell them what you want. With software this is not the case.
quote:There is absolutely nothing hush hush about it. In fact, everybody should know the change. Read Patchou's blog for example. He also had announced the change months ago (though not officially in a news post, but in one of his posts on this forums iirc).
Originally posted by Discrate
Anyway, where is the news post telling us what has happened? or weren't we suppose to find out? Is this all suppose to be hush hush?
Well i only just found out about this by reading andrey and WDZ talkign about it in the shoutbox.
Also i have been reading other forum posts such as willz on his forum. He also said that many people were left in the dark. An official forum post needs to be made asap, i would like to know what the capitalist have in store for us.
I do actually agree with you for once
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 03:51 AM
[KIND OF OFF TOPIC]
quote:Nope, it actually can not. You always use and pay for a program as it is, not as it could be.
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Yeah well it could be a service to use the program
A service is where you pay people to explicitly do something for you in the future. In this case you have the right to tell and demand the people what to do in a contract. And you do pay them for doing the stuff which is in the contract. If they do not do it, they breach the contract. You actually hire the people.
A software program is something different. Here you pay people for stuff which they already have done in the past. If you don't agree with the stuff they have done, you don't pay for the program but you would also have no right in using it. Unless you own the people (aka they are your own employees), you can not demand them what to do in a next version.
So, even if Plus! becomes payware. You still wouldn't have the right to demand something in a next version. They can listen, true, and it would show custom care, but they are not obligated to do so in any way.
[/OFF TOPIC]
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 04:24 AM
So is an announcement going to be made or what?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by kezz on 01-17-2010 at 10:38 AM
I imagine closer to the release of MP!L 5 something will be said about it.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Rolando on 01-17-2010 at 11:29 AM
I haven't read everything, but here goes my opinion:
No, he didn't. You've to remember he now has a store to look after, and MP!L is very time-consuming. He also wanted to bring in new developers so that we would get some new features- I don't see what's wrong with that.
And to make things clear.. Yuna Software =! Patchou. Patchou is just a developer now. He does not own Yuna Sofware, and YS owns MP!L.
On a lighter note, beta testers better get free versions if it becomes payware 
(Jk, I know it won't)
Oh and Discrate, of course an announcement will be made- in due time.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 11:43 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Rolando
I haven't read everything, but here goes my opinion:
No, he didn't. You've to remember he now has a store to look after, and MP!L is very time-consuming. He also wanted to bring in new developers so that we would get some new features- I don't see what's wrong with that.
And to make things clear.. Yuna Software =! Patchou. Patchou is just a developer now. He does not own Yuna Sofware, and YS owns MP!L.
On a lighter note, beta testers better get free versions if it becomes payware
Oh and Discrate, of course an announcement will be made- in due time.
Patchou owns a store?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-17-2010 at 12:47 PM
quote:Yes, that's quite old news by now
Originally posted by Discrate
Patchou owns a store?
. All the prices from the last contest also came from there. http://www.evolutionstore.ca/
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 12:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:Yes, that's quite old news by now
Originally posted by Discrate
Patchou owns a store?
http://www.evolutionstore.ca/
Yeh i knew all the prizes came from there, but i didn't realize he owned it! nice.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 02:04 PM
quote:its already a few months after the hush hush change took place, care to explain (even speculate) what they're waiting for.
Originally posted by Rolando
in due time.
* toddy finds it funny people are defending patchou, despite the lack of any (proper) announcement
(people who'd done a good thing(/nothing wrong) tend to shout about it from the roofs. it's the bad things in life that we keep quiet)
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 02:18 PM
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
quote:its already a few months after the hush hush change took place, care to explain (even speculate) what they're waiting for.
Originally posted by Rolando
in due time.
* toddy finds it funny people are defending patchou, despite the lack of any (proper) announcement
(people who'd done a good thing(/nothing wrong) tend to shout about it from the roofs. it's the bad things in life that we keep quiet)
[cookierevised]
It's not hush hush toddy, everybody should know. The changes were announced on his blog and in the banana irc.
[/cookierevised]
I totally agree with you toddy. I only found out because i read another conversation between people in the shoutbox. I think the majority of people would not know. An announcement needs to be made on the forums ASAP.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 02:56 PM
quote:yes, instead of being an asshole trying to make fun of people all the time and twisting around people's words, you might wanna pay attention sometimes to the real world.
Originally posted by Discrate
Patchou owns a store?
quote:I never said that.
Originally posted by Discrate
[cookierevised]
It's not hush hush toddy, everybody should know. The changes were announced on his blog and in the banana irc.
[/cookierevised]
quote:Patchou != Yuna Software.
Originally posted by toddy
* toddy finds it funny people are defending patchou, despite the lack of any (proper) announcement
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 03:15 PM
quote:indeed, however this thread is about patchou selling plus! thus people are either defending patchou or going against him (or of course staying clear)
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Patchou != Yuna Software.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 03:15 PM
quote:
yes, instead of being an asshole trying to make fun of people all the time and twisting around people's words, you might wanna pay attention sometimes to the real world.
Ummm where has it been mentioned that he owns the store? I can't possibly read every single post on the forum.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 03:32 PM
quote:hmm... I see you point.
Originally posted by toddy
quote:indeed, however this thread is about patchou selling plus! thus people are either defending patchou or going against him (or of course staying clear)
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Patchou != Yuna Software.
But you're forgetting a 3rd option: they are looking at it in an unbiased/technical way without defending nor judging Patchou.
Because selling-out technically means completely selling everything without any conditions, (and going on a loooong vacation on some tropical island (sort of
). Since Patchou did not just sold the company without any strings attached, without any conditions (there are contracts which do stipulate what they can or can not do with Plus!), it isn't a sell-out.But that wouldn't say a thing about Patchou doing a good thing or a bad thing in their opinion. That is another matter. So, nope, not everybody who says it is not a sell-out is also defending Patchou per-say... Those can be two very different things.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 04:02 PM
i'm not going to bother argue my case cookie, as its takes the thread away from the real issue.
but something for you (and others) to consider.
apart from you, who else on this thread (or even on the forum) knows details like that patchou put conditions in the usage of plus? (which all but rules out your 'unbiased/technical way' option)
which after all is what people want, to be given some information about the new owners of the software they use.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-17-2010 at 04:05 PM
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
i'm not going to bother argue my case cookie, as its takes the thread away from the real issue.
but something for you (and others) to consider.
apart from you, who else on this thread (or even on the forum) knows details like that patchou put conditions in the usage of plus?
which after all is what people want, to be given some information about the new owners of the software they use.
No one. He has barely given any info to beta testers either.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 04:43 PM
quote:for starters, beta testers
Originally posted by toddy
but something for you (and others) to consider.
apart from you, who else on this thread (or even on the forum) knows details like that patchou put conditions in the usage of plus? (which all but rules out your 'unbiased/technical way' option)
which after all is what people want, to be given some information about the new owners of the software they use.
(although we don't know every detail either of course and still want more info also)
There is also Patchou's public blog for example, which also states that he is still very involved in Yuna Software. With a complete sell-out he wouldn't.
And I replied before with that info exactly so that those who didn't know, now can know and maybe take that in account in their vote.
quote:Don't lie. You are not a beta tester... Patchou has given us a lot of info already, all the info he legally can give (where do you think I got my info from?). The rest of the missing info must come from Yuna itself, which is still lacking...
Originally posted by Discrate
No one. He has barely given any info to beta testers either.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 04:44 PM
quote:He doesn't have to tell anyone anything
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
i'm not going to bother argue my case cookie, as its takes the thread away from the real issue.
but something for you (and others) to consider.
apart from you, who else on this thread (or even on the forum) knows details like that patchou put conditions in the usage of plus?
which after all is what people want, to be given some information about the new owners of the software they use.
No one. He has barely given any info to beta testers either.
If he did, it would be good. However as cookie said he has no legal obligation to listen to use or hear our requests.
So really, imo, he can do what he wants and we just hope for the best.
At least he's not censoring us about the sale like 110mb.com is doing.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 05:43 PM
quote:can't speak for what was said to the beta testers, but patchou blog says next to nothing about the situation i.e. its very vage. which doesn't really give people confidence in the change/sale.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
for starters, beta testers
(although we don't know every detail either of course and still want more info also)
There is also Patchou's public blog for example, which also states that he is still very involved in Yuna Software. With a complete sell-out he wouldn't.
And I replied before with that info exactly so that those who didn't know, now can know and maybe take that in account in their vote.
quote:so you're happy for a piece of software on your machine that has an auto-update feature to change hands, with (next to) nothing being said about the change. (as for the legal part, i'm not sure that's correct but cba researching)
Originally posted by krissy-afc
He doesn't have to tell anyone anything
quote:its hardly an open subject is it.
Originally posted by krissy-afc
At least he's not censoring us about the sale like 110mb.com is doing.
p.s.
cookie i don't think the real issue is a "total" sell-out, its the fact that its changed hands & patchou is no longer in charge of what happens/is installed/is added etc (bar some conditions in the contract [which as i said earlier, hardly anyone knows])
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 06:38 PM
Well, toddy, i am fine with it.
If anything dodgy happens i don't like I'll just un-install it. If it's more serious than that i have security on my computer so im sure ill be safe.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 06:47 PM
well you're an idiot*
* for lots of reason, but this time for not caring what u install
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 07:02 PM
Well I do, but, come on if Plus! (with 60Million+ Users) did anything dodgy it would get fucke*d big time!
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 07:13 PM
who would you 'fuck' since have no idea who yuna are ?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 07:22 PM
I do.
Yuna Software is a Canadian company. Based at 43 boul. Samson Suite 270 Laval, Quebec H7X 3R8.
Also it's based with Arrow IT Solutions. (http://www.arrowit.com/) And alot more companies:
Arbo Concep
Arrow IT Solutions
Déneigement GrandMaison
Déneigement JVL
Flashway Inc
Hach Compan
Ideal Exhibit
THE UPS Store
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-17-2010 at 07:31 PM
are you really going to make me call you an idiot again?
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 07:48 PM
quote:I strongly doubt you also know all the details of who owns what, how and when for all the other programs installed on your computer... You/we would be surprised at how much stuff changes in the business world owning the programs you/we use without any notification to the people using the programs.
Originally posted by toddy
so you're happy for a piece of software on your machine that has an auto-update feature to change hands, with (next to) nothing being said about the change. (as for the legal part, i'm not sure that's correct but cba researching)
quote:Maybe, but in that case the poll question is very wrong.
Originally posted by toddy
p.s. cookie i don't think the real issue is a "total" sell-out, its the fact that its changed hands & patchou is no longer in charge of what happens/is installed/is added etc (bar some conditions in the contract [which as i said earlier, hardly anyone knows])
------------
PS: But it is not entirly true either that all of a sudden Yuna Software now owns Plus! though.
Yuna Software has owned Plus! for years.
Patchou simply kept using his nickname for simplicity.
Now, the company that used to be created by Patchou and from Patchou only, is now sold to other people.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 08:21 PM
@Cookie:
So Years ago Yuna software owned by patchou owned Plus!? And now someone had bought Yuna Software that also owns Plus??
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 08:23 PM
quote:absolutely correct!
Originally posted by krissy-afc
@Cookie:
So Years ago Yuna software owned by patchou owned Plus!? And now someone had bought Yuna Software that also owns Plus??
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 08:55 PM
So, just because the copyrights and stuff say 'Yuna Software' it doesn't really mean it's now sold ?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 09:04 PM
quote:hu? you lost me there....
Originally posted by krissy-afc
So, just because the copyrights and stuff say 'Yuna Software' it doesn't really mean it's now sold
You can't see from just a copyright notice if the company has been sold or not; A copyright notice shows who owns the copyright. It does not show who owns the company that owns the copyright.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-17-2010 at 09:14 PM
I mean, now that plus has changed to Yuna Software that doesn't mean someone has bought it?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-17-2010 at 09:26 PM
quote:No, not automatically. Because Plus! hasn't been 'changed' to Yuna Software just now.
Originally posted by krissy-afc
I mean, now that plus has changed to Yuna Software that doesn't mean someone has bought it?
Plus! has been 'changed' to Yuna Software a long time ago, as in many years ago. At that point Patchou still owned Yuna Software and as the only one in that company, and nothing was sold at all.
The company is still the same company as the one years ago, only the amount of players and their function in that company have now been changed.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by vaccination on 01-17-2010 at 09:49 PM
quote:Plus! was a product of a company called Yuna Software headed by Patchou, it has now been sold to new proprietors and Patchou no longer calls the shots, if I understand correctly.
Originally posted by krissy-afc
I mean, now that plus has changed to Yuna Software that doesn't mean someone has bought it?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-17-2010 at 11:41 PM
quote:That's Patchou's
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Yuna Software is a Canadian company. Based at <address>
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by stoshrocket on 01-17-2010 at 11:56 PM
quote:looks like a ups or general store to me
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Yuna Software is a Canadian company. Based at 43 boul. Samson Suite 270 Laval, Quebec H7X 3R8.
On a more relevant note, I don't think he did, although time will tell whether the involvment of this company (whoever it's lead by and whoever is involved) leads to a bright future or a dismal outcome.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Rolando on 01-18-2010 at 12:59 AM
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
quote:its already a few months after the hush hush change took place, care to explain (even speculate) what they're waiting for.
Originally posted by Rolando
in due time.
We certainly don't have all the answers. I'm not the new owner.
* toddy finds it funny people are defending patchou, despite the lack of any (proper) announcement
(people who'd done a good thing(/nothing wrong) tend to shout about it from the roofs. it's the bad things in life that we keep quiet)
Remember Patchou is not the owner of YS. He can't legally make any sort of announcement anymore. He shared all he could with the general public in his blog post. The announcement will come soon...
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Don't lie. You are not a beta tester... Patchou has given us a lot of info already, all the info he legally can give (where do you think I got my info from?). The rest of the missing info must come from Yuna itself, which is still lacking...
(Same as what I said)
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
so you're happy for a piece of software on your machine that has an auto-update feature to change hands, with (next to) nothing being said about the change. (as for the legal part, i'm not sure that's correct but cba researching)
It asks you before it downloads the update, and Patchou wouldn't let them ruin his hard work, remember he is still in the team. You can cancel the update and read the changelog (as there's usually one posted with every update) before you update if you'd like. Some changes might be made, like sponsors, but I'm pretty sure those will still remain optional. If not it's not like MP!L can't be uninstalled, tho I'm sure it won't come to that.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Th3rmal on 01-18-2010 at 01:03 AM
My question is, now when we have questions/queries/problems/suggestions or whatever about MP!L, do we give them to Patchou still? Or does he not have that much pull any more?
Im just curious because im wondering if from now on, our suggestions and what not will be as actively taken into account like they used to be when it was just Patchou
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-18-2010 at 01:22 AM
quote:don't talk crap
Originally posted by Rolando
He can't legally make any sort of announcement anymore. He shared all he could with the general public in his blog post.
quote:most people are in a team at work, but at the end of the day boss is gonna do want he wants.
Originally posted by Rolando
remember he is still in the team
quote:how do you know what changes will be made in the new update....
Originally posted by Rolando
If not it's not like MP!L can't be uninstalled
as for the update log etc, how many people read them?
with the current situation i.e. no real public announcement, people will just think that they should upgrade to the newer version since they haven't been informed of any major changes
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chris4 on 01-18-2010 at 02:05 AM
quote:Like he said in his blog post, he's not personally related with Plus! any more. Anything related to Plus! should go to Yuna Software's email, if you're lucky enough to get a reply.
Originally posted by Th3rmal
My question is, now when we have questions/queries/problems/suggestions or whatever about MP!L, do we give them to Patchou still? Or does he not have that much pull any more?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by WDZ on 01-18-2010 at 02:24 AM
quote:I think the way you phrased that is kind of misleading... he's still part of the Yuna Software team working on Plus!, but his role has changed.
Originally posted by Chris4
Like he said in his blog post, he's not personally related with Plus! any more.
quote:
Originally posted by Patchou
That being said, at the time of writing, I'm still actively involved in Yuna Software's daily business, and we're still preparing what should be called Messenger Plus! 5 in 2010.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-18-2010 at 02:31 AM
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chris4 on 01-18-2010 at 02:56 AM
quote:Fair enough, maybe "he's not personally associated with Plus!" would be a better way to put it, as in: "Yuna Software" are officially the owners and not "Patchou".
Originally posted by WDZ
quote:I think the way you phrased that is kind of misleading... he's still part of the Yuna Software team working on Plus!, but his role has changed.
Originally posted by Chris4
Like he said in his blog post, he's not personally related with Plus! any more.
quote:
Originally posted by Patchou
That being said, at the time of writing, I'm still actively involved in Yuna Software's daily business, and we're still preparing what should be called Messenger Plus! 5 in 2010.
I'm sure I remember him saying that Plus!-related issues should be sent to Yuna Software and not to himself, which is what I meant by my first post.
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.patchou.com/projects/msgplus/
I decided it was time for me to remove myself personally from the software
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by charlie_su1986 on 01-18-2010 at 08:35 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Th3rmal
My question is, now when we have questions/queries/problems/suggestions or whatever about MP!L, do we give them to Patchou still? Or does he not have that much pull any more?
Im just curious because im wondering if from now on, our suggestions and what not will be as actively taken into account like they used to be when it was just Patchou
No we don't. There isn't much he can do. Yuna Software is in full control, they can even close down the forum if they like.
I'd say all we can do now is cross our fingers and hope for the best. though for now I personally don't have a good feeling about this. Pretty much everything is kept in the dark, there's not even a single post from Yuna on the forum, let alone a proper announcement.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Mnjul on 01-18-2010 at 08:59 AM
quote:Not really. Yuna owns the msghelp.net domain, but the forum server, including the hardware and the software, is still ours. We can change our domain and remain open (although probably no longer the "official" Plus! forums) should Yuna no longer needs the forums.
Originally posted by charlie_su1986
they can even close down the forum if they like.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by user27089 on 01-18-2010 at 09:25 AM
quote:Definitely giving that one a thumbs up. As I said in my previous post, I think that Yuna Software will be less personal, so by them making people think that Patchou is in charge or at least have a massive say in the software, people will remain as loyal to it.
Originally posted by Discrate
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
I've said it before, I'd love to see the conversion rates of the Messenger Plus! and Messenger Plus! Forum sites (the former being click-through then download and the latter being click-through, register then post) - I'm sure it's decreasing. Though that's for another day entirely.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-18-2010 at 10:44 AM
quote:Yes, hence it is a PO Box. It is the official postal address of Yuna Software and has been for many years.
Originally posted by stoshrocket
quote:looks like a ups or general store to me
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Yuna Software is a Canadian company. Based at 43 boul. Samson Suite 270 Laval, Quebec H7X 3R8.
Just as there are other PO Boxes from other companies at that same address. And before people start jumping to the wrong conlusions: no there is nothing fishy about it. A PO Box is a very official address usually located in a post office, ups store or other postal service building. Hence why there are usually many companies registered at the same address.
quote:There is nothing crap about what Rolando has said though, he is correct.
Originally posted by toddy
quote:don't talk crap
Originally posted by Rolando
He can't legally make any sort of announcement anymore. He shared all he could with the general public in his blog post.
Almost every single contract you sign in the real world contains some sort of disclosure act. This is especially true for businesses and contracts involving ownership change etc. There is absolutely nothing strange about such contracts. Such NDAs which limit what you can share are extremely common. This is how the real world works...
What sometimes is crap are some of the speculations and conclusions some people come up with.
eg: crap like this:
quote:We have said before that there is nothing hush hush about the change. Many info is available (about the change, why the change was made and what Patchou's role is in all of this), including Patchou's own words about the matter. If they wanted to hide behind Patchou's name, why do you think the info that is available, is available? Why would every reference in Plus!, the forums and website state 'Yuna Software' instead of 'Patchou'?, etc...
Originally posted by Discrate
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
If they wanted to hide behind the name 'Patchou' you wouldn't see 'Yuna Software' printed everywhere.
So stop being an idiot, and before 'thinking' something, read what has been said before, and look at the real existing stuff instead of fabricating all kinds of bull shit which you can not back up in any way.
quote:We don't know the exact details of the contract between Patchou and Yuna Software and to what exact extent Yuna Software can make changes. But what we do know is that there _are_ limitations to what they can do with Plus! (again, hence this is not a complete sell-out). They do not have all the freedom in the world, they are bound to contracts too.
Originally posted by toddy
quote:how do you know what changes will be made in the new update....
Originally posted by Rolando
If not it's not like MP!L can't be uninstalled
This said, it will always be possible to uninstall Plus!, that would be plain common sense.
quote:Why on earth should they not upgrade???
Originally posted by toddy
as for the update log etc, how many people read them?
with the current situation i.e. no real public announcement, people will just think that they should upgrade to the newer version since they haven't been informed of any major changes
The whole point of this change is that Plus! can be developed further. If Patchou wouldn't have done what he did, then there would be no Plus! anymore, at all.
I very strongly encourage to first read Patchou's statement on his blog.
RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by user27089 on 01-18-2010 at 06:07 PM
Cookie, I don't mean any offence by this but I really think you're in denial. Every day fewer people are using Windows Live Messenger and subsequently Messenger Plus! Live. Patchou pulled out a good time and "sold out" - not in a derogatory way.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-18-2010 at 08:45 PM
quote:Believe it or not, active Plus! user count is still growing.
Originally posted by traxor
Every day fewer people are using Windows Live Messenger and subsequently Messenger Plus! Live. Patchou pulled out a good time and "sold out" - not in a derogatory way.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by user27089 on 01-18-2010 at 09:29 PM
quote:Stats tell a different story.
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:Believe it or not, active Plus! user count is still growing.
Originally posted by traxor
Every day fewer people are using Windows Live Messenger and subsequently Messenger Plus! Live. Patchou pulled out a good time and "sold out" - not in a derogatory way.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by prashker on 01-18-2010 at 09:34 PM
quote:Nobody cares about forum stats
Originally posted by traxor
quote:Stats tell a different story.
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:Believe it or not, active Plus! user count is still growing.
Originally posted by traxor
Every day fewer people are using Windows Live Messenger and subsequently Messenger Plus! Live. Patchou pulled out a good time and "sold out" - not in a derogatory way.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-18-2010 at 09:35 PM
Registrations on the forums do not necessary reflect on the amount of Plus! users 
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by andrey on 01-18-2010 at 09:40 PM
quote:active plus! user count != user registrations on this forum
Originally posted by traxor
quote:Stats tell a different story.
Originally posted by Menthix
quote:Believe it or not, active Plus! user count is still growing.
Originally posted by traxor
Every day fewer people are using Windows Live Messenger and subsequently Messenger Plus! Live. Patchou pulled out a good time and "sold out" - not in a derogatory way.
sure, the community around msn/wlm (mess.be etc) is falling apart a bit, but with 50+ million users currently using plus!, yuna isn't going to break a sweat over over those few members on here complaining about the current lack of communication.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by vaccination on 01-18-2010 at 09:48 PM
quote:That just means less and less people are needing help with Plus!, so Plus! must just be getting better and better
Originally posted by traxor
Stats tell a different story.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by user27089 on 01-18-2010 at 10:09 PM
I know that forum stats don't necessarily count but the more users of plus! there are, the more problems people have with it - that includes ridiculous problems.
I'm sure that if you compare the statistics of Plus! downloads against the statistics of Plus! Forum members, there will be a correlation.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-18-2010 at 11:11 PM
quote:Non taken...
Originally posted by traxor
Cookie, I don't mean any offence by this...
quote:I sure am not though.
Originally posted by traxor
...but I really think you're in denial.
(and you can check that out yourself by reading the private beta forum where I was the first to report a verifyable issue with the current version)
The big difference is, I try to not base my findings on here-say, assumptions, personal opinions or other speculations that are on their turn based upon personal feelings or stuff that is either irrelevant or completely taken out of context or taken out of thin air.
eg: those forum stats
I'll judge Yuna Software on the things we can check and verify without bias, combined with common sense. Not on the mass hysteria where people construct paranoid conspiracy theories and jump to conclussions because they do not know, or not read, the information at hand.
As such I certainly do not deny that there are some problems. But I will not join this mass hysteria and doom-thinking, nor state personal feelings and opinions for facts.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Menthix on 01-18-2010 at 11:19 PM
quote:Forum stats aren't software users stats. I've seen the actual numbers.
Originally posted by traxor
Stats tell a different story.
quote:Nope. Well, maybe, afterall, the registered forum user count is still going up too
Originally posted by traxor
I'm sure that if you compare the statistics of Plus! downloads against the statistics of Plus! Forum members, there will be a correlation.
.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 12:35 AM
quote:
Originally posted by traxor
quote:Definitely giving that one a thumbs up. As I said in my previous post, I think that Yuna Software will be less personal, so by them making people think that Patchou is in charge or at least have a massive say in the software, people will remain as loyal to it.
Originally posted by Discrate
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
I've said it before, I'd love to see the conversion rates of the Messenger Plus! and Messenger Plus! Forum sites (the former being click-through then download and the latter being click-through, register then post) - I'm sure it's decreasing. Though that's for another day entirely.
Exactly. What other reason is there to not make an announcement on the forum about it? There is no other reason other then the company still wants everyone to think patchou is in charge.
I read somewhere that patchou can't even talk about the full details because it's against the contract.
Make this thread should be directed to the people at Yuna Software so show them that we know about what has happened.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-19-2010 at 12:45 AM
quote:Yes, that is 'old' news. So what's your point?
Originally posted by Discrate
I read somewhere that patchou can't even talk about the full details because it's against the contract.
Like I said before, almost every contract, especially contracts involving business sales, have a NDA. There is absolutely nothing abnormal about it.
And there is also no coverup in any way. Go troll somewhere else if you don't care about how the real world actually functions.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 12:55 AM
quote:granted most contract will ban any talk of money and terms etc, not very many ban people from announcing/telling the users about the sale.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Like I said before, almost every contract, especially contracts involving business sales, have a NDA. There is absolutely nothing abnormal about it.
before you say its on his blog, how many people actually know about his blog? and possibly more important where would an average user expect to find details/news on a piece of software. The software's website/forum, or a personal blog of the (old) owner......
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by andrey on 01-19-2010 at 01:00 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:What's your point?
Originally posted by Discrate
I read somewhere that patchou can't even talk about the full details because it's against the contract.
Like I said before, almost every contract, especially contracts involving business sales, have a NDA. There is absolutely nothing abnormal about it.
And there is also no coverup in any way. Go troll somewhere else if you don't care about how the real world actually functions.
Oh come on, this discussion is getting ridiculous. All we want is a post by Patchou either explaining that he can't give any more details about the sale because of the contract or announcing when/if he can go into a bit more detail about it.
Tbh what disappoints me atm is that I would have expected something more personal (an announcement directed at the forum, on the forum) than the post on his blog.
I won't jump to conclusions at this point though, maybe he's just gone on a surprise vacation
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrono on 01-19-2010 at 01:13 AM
quote:surprise vacation
Originally posted by andrey
I won't jump to conclusions at this point though, maybe he's just gone on a surprise vacation
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 01:23 AM
quote:Yeah, that's so true
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:I read somewhere that patchou can't even talk about the full details because it's against the contract.
Originally posted by traxor
quote:Definitely giving that one a thumbs up. As I said in my previous post, I think that Yuna Software will be less personal, so by them making people think that Patchou is in charge or at least have a massive say in the software, people will remain as loyal to it.
Originally posted by Discrate
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
I've said it before, I'd love to see the conversion rates of the Messenger Plus! and Messenger Plus! Forum sites (the former being click-through then download and the latter being click-through, register then post) - I'm sure it's decreasing. Though that's for another day entirely.
He just made a 4 pages blog post about Messenger Plus! to break that
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 01:39 AM
quote:the last page is the only 1 that actually mentions it, and its very very vage. HTH
Originally posted by krissy-afc
quote:Yeah, that's so true
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:I read somewhere that patchou can't even talk about the full details because it's against the contract.
Originally posted by traxor
quote:Definitely giving that one a thumbs up. As I said in my previous post, I think that Yuna Software will be less personal, so by them making people think that Patchou is in charge or at least have a massive say in the software, people will remain as loyal to it.
Originally posted by Discrate
I think that no real announcement has been made because the new owners still want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
I've said it before, I'd love to see the conversion rates of the Messenger Plus! and Messenger Plus! Forum sites (the former being click-through then download and the latter being click-through, register then post) - I'm sure it's decreasing. Though that's for another day entirely.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-19-2010 at 02:13 AM
quote:Patchou WAS NOT prohibited from telling about the sale. he did talked about it in his public blog.
Originally posted by toddy
granted most contract will ban any talk of money and terms etc, not very many ban people from announcing/telling the users about the sale.
He is prohibited to talk about the _details_ of the sale. Just like anyone else in any other business would be prohibited to talk about such things. And that is almost never limited to just talking about money.
quote:1) Why on earth would Patchou tell about the fact he sold Yuna Software in his PUBLIC blog if he wasn't allowed or if they wanted to keep everything secret?
Originally posted by toddy
before you say its on his blog, how many people actually know about his blog? and possibly more important where would a average user expect to find details on a piece of software. The software's website/forum, or a personal blog of the (old) owner......
That simply would not make any sense at all.
2) What does it actually matter where it is posted? Even if it was posted in the local news paper only, it is still PUBLIC for EVERYBODY to read and thus EVERYBODY can know about it.
3) The link to his blog has been posted several times already on this forum.
4) Patchou's blog isn't the only indication of the sale. There are plenty other signs like the headers on the forum and websites, the digital signatures in the exe, the About box in Plus!. And all these things can by seen by anyone smart enough to read. Especially the About box, which is the very first thing people will look at if they are interested at who made the software.
Thus:
1) Patchou HAS talked about the sale in PUBLIC
2) There are MANY public signs of the sale, both on the forums, websites, and in Plus! itself
3) It is NO secret at all that he sold Yuna Software
4) NOBODY is trying to cover things up
5) NDAs are not only about money
Seriously people, use your commen sense!
-----
quote:Granted... But that would solve what? Many trustable people have already stated that he can't talk about the details.
Originally posted by andrey
Oh come on, this discussion is getting ridiculous. All we want is a post by Patchou either explaining that he can't give any more details about the sale because of the contract or announcing when/if he can go into a bit more detail about it.
Also, the fact that he can't talk about details should be plain common logic if you know a bit how such business is conducted in the real world.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 02:17 AM
quote:how many times has patchou posted it...........
Originally posted by CookieRevised
3) The link to his blog has been posted several times already on this forum.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:18 AM
If it's a personal blog I see no reason for him to link to it from work.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by toddy
quote:how many times has patchou posted it...........
Originally posted by CookieRevised
3) The link to his blog has been posted several times already on this forum.
Toddy is correct. Hardly anyone knows about the blog post. I didn't till i pmed someone saying "where is the information" The majority of users wouldn't about it.
Cookie, just stop with the defending. There should be a post about what has happened on this forums. It's stupid just to keep saying "Oh everyone should know, it's posted on patchous blog"
If this all was not a cover up there would be an official announcement plain and simple. Yuna software is trying to make the majority of people think patchou is still in charge.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 02:22 AM
quote:2)since patchou owned yuna to recently, how is that a sign of the sale
Originally posted by CookieRevised
2) There are MANY public signs of the sale, both on the forums, websites, and in Plus! itself
3) It is NO secret at all that he sold Yuna Software
4) NOBODY is trying to cover things up
3)why's he avoiding this thread like the plague then
4)see above
quote:we are doing, which is very most think that the situation is dodgy as hell.
Originally posted by CookieRevised
use your commen sense!
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:26 AM
quote:You've said that how many times?
Originally posted by Discrate
Toddy is correct.
What's with sucking up his ass?quote:We all do
Originally posted by Discrate
Hardly anyone knows about the blog post.
quote:Of course he's going to defend him. They have knew each other for years and their friends
Originally posted by Discrate
Cookie, just stop with the defending. There should be a post about what has happened on this forums. It's stupid just to keep saying "Oh everyone should know, it's posted on patchous blog"
If Patchou is quite about the sale then he OBV doesn't want to announce it I do agree it's dodgy and not right, but it is the way it is
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:27 AM
If this all wasn't hush hush, there would be an announcement plain and simple.
The fact is Yuna software owners want the majority of people to still think patchou is in charge.
Many people agree on this, and i find it funny that cookie is still being the arrogant prick that he is and saying "NO YOU'RE WRONG!" "NO YOU'RE STUPID! "WHAT EVER MY OPINION IS, IT'S FACT."
Only regular members of this forum know patchou doesn't own it anymore. Because they go onto patchous blog and other forums etc.
I am a regular member and i had no idea about the change till i entered the shoutbox.
Saying "everyone knows" or "everybody should know" is just stupid.
quote:
Originally posted by krissy-afc
quote:You've said that how many times?
Originally posted by Discrate
Toddy is correct.
quote:We all do
Originally posted by Discrate
Hardly anyone knows about the blog post.
quote:Of course he's going to defend him. They have knew each other for years and their friends
Originally posted by Discrate
Cookie, just stop with the defending. There should be a post about what has happened on this forums. It's stupid just to keep saying "Oh everyone should know, it's posted on patchous blog"
I do agree it's dodgy and not right, but it is the way it is
so all 50 million plus users know about patchous blog post? How did you conduct this survey?
Think before you speak, jesus.
All the reg forum members might no about it, but not the majority of plus users.
P.S I am not sucking up toddys arse, i keep repeating toddy is correct because cookie keeps replying with "NOPE YOU'RE WRONG! I AM RIGHT! NO NO" Seriously krissy, just leave the discussion. every post you make is stupid.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:33 AM
No, you're right! They wont know about the sale but do they need to know?
Since the sale nothing has changed except the owner. I don't see why they would need to know?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by albert on 01-19-2010 at 02:36 AM
Guys, seriously, I've been reading these kind of posts for over a week now, staying away without commenting, but I think it reached a level that irritates me a little bit.
Weither he ''sold out'' (I have only a vague idea of what that really means but that's not really the point ) or not, whatever happened, happened. It is fair for everyone to have his own opinion about it and that's cool. You do have the right to agree, or disagree with the situation without a single inch of doubt.
It's important to point out though, that it gets to be a little annoying, but also certainly a little insulting creating these kind of arrogant threads on the same forums which in a way, are there thanks to the same guy you are all referring to.
I am not saying that to pick on anyone, but a little bit of respect; both to people's opinions and Patchou's decision is minimally required when posting on his damn forums.
[/rant] *albert goes back to working..
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:36 AM
quote:
Originally posted by krissy-afc
No, you're right! They wont know about the sale but do they need to know?
Since the sale nothing has changed except the owner. I don't see why they would need to know?
I am sure everyone would like to know patchou isn't running the show anymore. I am also sure they would like to know details of the deal. What's going to change? What's going to happen?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:39 AM
Yuna software hasn't done anything to the software yet.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Yuna software hasn't done anything to the software yet.
Omg /facepalm.
We fucking know.
Just stop posting.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-19-2010 at 02:42 AM
quote:2) Posts in the forums. And until recently signatures in Plus! and on the website where signed by 'Patchou'. Since the sale, it is 'Yuna Software'
Originally posted by toddy
quote:2)since patchou owned yuna to recently, how is that a sign of the sale
Originally posted by CookieRevised
2) There are MANY public signs of the sale, both on the forums, websites, and in Plus! itself
3) It is NO secret at all that he sold Yuna Software
4) NOBODY is trying to cover things up
3)why's he avoiding this thread like the plague then
4) see above
3) First of all, he reads this thread too. But there are reasons which prohibit him to post details and/or answer some of the questions you have.
quote:please read CookieRevised's reply to Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out?
Originally posted by krissy-afc
Of course he's going to defend him. They have knew each other for years and their friends
1) Being friends has got nothing to do with this. Common sense and looking at the facts instead of theorizing all kinds of bull shit, have everything to do with it.
2) Patchou doesn't need to be defended. If something is wrong it is Yuna Software's fault, not Patchou's.
quote:How is that so obvious?
Originally posted by krissy-afc
If Patchou is quite about the sale then he OBV doesn't want to announce it
See, this is EXACTLY what I constantly mean with jumping to conclusions and constructing all kinds of theories.
Because have you considered that there might be other reasons why he hasn't posted yet?
And because there MIGHT* be other reasons, it should be good enough not to jump to conclusions like Discrate does. Conclusions which he has no proof for at all other than his own very scewed conspiracy theories.
It is one thing to be concerned and worried (like we all do), it is another thing to theorize all that crapy stuff.
* And as a matter of fact (note the word 'fact', Discrate), there are other reasons than the one you think. And those reasons have been explained before in this very same public thread by trustable people.
-------
EDIT:
quote:Sure Discrate, continue to make a massive fool out of yourself. Let's wait for Patchou to post and let's see how right you are and how wrong I am...
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:Of course he (sic: Cookie) hasn't. He only believes in what he says.
Originally posted by Toddy
have you consider that these other reasons don't exist....?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:43 AM
Well what's the fucking problem? If you want to know what's changing, wait until it's happening.
Us two sitting here, arguing like a bunch of twats isn't certainly going to change/do anything.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 02:44 AM
quote:have you consider that these other reasons don't exist....?
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Have you ever considered that there might be other reasons why he hasn't posted yet?
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 02:48 AM
Patchou has noted all our views!
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Lou on 01-19-2010 at 03:12 AM
quote:Is that honestly any of your business though? Did shares for the company go up for sale recently where you bought something that entitles you to NDA information about a software? No? Didn't think so.
Originally posted by Discrate
I am also sure they would like to know details of the deal. What's going to change? What's going to happen?
If you all think it's that weird and are so insulted, just fucking leave
. There are perfectly good reasons for Patchou not talking about the move on these forums (one of them being your attitude towards it. You never even tried approaching him properly about it. ). I know, and Patchou knows, that several of us (I'm not excluding myself) were quite rude with him the other night when we had a chat, but he explained all of the situation (well, what he was allowed to say) to us. I feel bad, and I apologize for my actions. I've managed to get over it . It's not the end of the world.There are legal reasons behind what you can and cannot know. The move to Yuna software is evident, and I'm sure you'll get more information later. As of now, nothing in the software has really changed. It may in the future, but you'll know.
For those of you scared of them magically implementing all this background malware, etc, that can't be opted out.. seriously, wtf? You realize that as a legal entity, the company can't do that? Plus, there's no forced updates for Plus!. Ever. Plus! isn't going to magically become a spam generating machine that will steal all your bank account information (Over-exaggerating, but then, so are you)
I'm not one that was quite fond with the move myself, as Cookie and many others will vouch for, but I'm not going to sit here and watch you lot act like complete morons either. Grow up.
Until you own shares, you are only entitled to the information they choose to give you. Frankly, testers know just about as much as you do, and we've gotten over it.
Edit: Besides, as these are the official forums, do you really think he's going to just go ahead and make an announcement without getting approval by the rest of Yuna software? That's just stupid.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 03:18 AM
So it is to much to ask for a simple "I have sold Yuna" in the announcement section? He could of even made the announcement before he sold it. Before he was bound by a contract not to say anything.
and if he is worried about what we will say, he's only made it 10 times worse by keeping everyone in the dark.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 03:30 AM
He's not making it worse at all.
It's kinda a fallback plan the way i see it.
If he says nothing and allows everyone else (cookie etc) to talk and put forward facts nothing can fall back on him. So when people announce the sale and start speculating/discussing anything said has not came (directly) from him so therefore he will get off the hook.
If he isn't allowed to talk about it he cant get fucked for it because it's not him saying anything.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Rolando on 01-19-2010 at 03:46 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
So it is to much to ask for a simple "I have sold Yuna" in the announcement section? He could of even made the announcement before he sold it. Before he was bound by a contract not to say anything.
and if he is worried about what we will say, he's only made it 10 times worse by keeping everyone in the dark.
He did say he is not the owner anymore. Read his blog post. If you can't be arsed to read it in its entirety then please stop posting.
I'm going to refrain from posting in this thread again, but yeah, just be patient. There'll be an announcement.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Hank on 01-19-2010 at 04:32 AM
quote:thats still not 100% positive there
Originally posted by WDZ
quote:I think the way you phrased that is kind of misleading... he's still part of the Yuna Software team working on Plus!, but his role has changed.
Originally posted by Chris4
Like he said in his blog post, he's not personally related with Plus! any more.
quote:
Originally posted by Patchou
That being said, at the time of writing, I'm still actively involved in Yuna Software's daily business, and we're still preparing what should be called Messenger Plus! 5 in 2010.
an saying that i think this thread should be closed before it gets out of hand, its just gonna get the general public worried if it gets out
i think we should all wait till there's something Official from Patchou or Yuna
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 05:51 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Rolando
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
So it is to much to ask for a simple "I have sold Yuna" in the announcement section? He could of even made the announcement before he sold it. Before he was bound by a contract not to say anything.
and if he is worried about what we will say, he's only made it 10 times worse by keeping everyone in the dark.
He did say he is not the owner anymore. Read his blog post. If you can't be arsed to read it in its entirety then please stop posting.
I'm going to refrain from posting in this thread again, but yeah, just be patient. There'll be an announcement.
I did read the blog post. But you are missing the point i am trying to make. Not EVERYONE knows about his blog post.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Hank on 01-19-2010 at 05:55 AM
should be called Messenger Plus! 5
any possibilities of a Name change perhaps?
maybe there should be a link on this forum made of his Blog
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by vaccination on 01-19-2010 at 08:18 AM
quote:We shouldn't have to go 'clue hunting' to find out the owner of Plus! has changed
Originally posted by CookieRevised
2) There are MANY public signs of the sale, both on the forums, websites, and in Plus! itself
Not to mention that simply changing the footer tags to Yuna instead of Patchou doesn't indicate a sale in anyway, it is [was] his company so it'd make sense to put it at the footer. I agree with everyone who feels a personal thread in the Announcements sub forum would indeed be highly appropriate, I thought the community was supposed to be a large aspect of Plus!? Saying he posted it on his blog has no bearing at all, all other information in the past, including things like newest updates, competitions and other stuff related to Plus!'s development etc. has all been posted on the forum. Why? Because this is where the majority of the community here gets their information, it is not unreasonable then to expect a post explaining the issues and what is going on. [Don't bring up contractual obligations, there is absolutely no reason what so ever he could not announce the change to us and let such a 'loyal' community know what's happening to a piece of software and its creator they have come to know/love]
As a side note, I'm not on the "omg lyke its r conspiracy this r terrible" bandwagon
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Lou on 01-19-2010 at 10:58 AM
quote:I get the feeling you have no clue whatsoever how businesses work. He was already under NDA when they began talking about selling it in the first place most likely. Otherwise, before signing the last contract, he would have legally been entitled to say everything about it
Originally posted by Discrate
So it is to much to ask for a simple "I have sold Yuna" in the announcement section? He could of even made the announcement before he sold it. Before he was bound by a contract not to say anything.
and if he is worried about what we will say, he's only made it 10 times worse by keeping everyone in the dark.
. There are a lot more rules than you may think involved in this. But of course you wouldn't know, because you didn't see the contract. Seeing as none of us are in that position where we are meant to see the contract, there's no obligation from any of them, plus, they're busy.
RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by 5n4k3 on 01-19-2010 at 12:53 PM
quote:
I did read the blog post. But you are missing the point i am trying to make. Not EVERYONE knows about his blog post.
Most people probably don't care who owns MP!. And those that would read an "official announcement" would probably find this thread, leading them to Patchou's blog.
I'm not taking sides here, merely mentioning the fact that if you cared at all about this topic, this thread would be pretty hard to miss.
~ 5n4k3
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 01:17 PM
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by 5n4k3 on 01-19-2010 at 01:29 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 01:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
But what if i have totally no idea about the change? Why would i just randomly go to patchous blog? I didn't even know patchou had a blog until this thread made.
People arn't just going to start randomly searching
RE: RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by 5n4k3 on 01-19-2010 at 02:12 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
But what if i have totally no idea about the change? Why would i just randomly go to patchous blog? I didn't even know patchou had a blog until this thread made.
People arn't just going to start randomly searching
I never said you randomly go to Patchou's Blog, I said you would find this thread which would lead you there.
~ 5n4k3
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
But what if i have totally no idea about the change? Why would i just randomly go to patchous blog? I didn't even know patchou had a blog until this thread made.
People arn't just going to start randomly searching
I never said you randomly go to Patchou's Blog, I said you would find this thread which would lead you there.
~ 5n4k3
But that's the whole point. People shouldn't have to go through a paper trail to find out whats going on.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by 5n4k3 on 01-19-2010 at 02:50 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
But what if i have totally no idea about the change? Why would i just randomly go to patchous blog? I didn't even know patchou had a blog until this thread made.
People arn't just going to start randomly searching
I never said you randomly go to Patchou's Blog, I said you would find this thread which would lead you there.
~ 5n4k3
But that's the whole point. People shouldn't have to go through a paper trail to find out whats going on.
An announcement is going to be made eventually. And if you're dying to find out what's going on I'm sure you wouldn't mind looking around a little.
If there was another update then it might be a bigger issue, but it really doesn't matter to the majority of MP! users right now.
The few that do know are probably just taking an interest in this event or just like being kept up to speed with things.
For instance, if Patchou didn't have anything about this on his blog. And the announcement was made close to the next update of MP!. In other words, the announcement being the first time you hear of this topic. IF there was no date specified would you care? If you would want to know (which you probably do) would it be for any particular reason besides you simply "wanting to know"?
~ 5n4k3
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Discrate on 01-19-2010 at 02:56 PM
quote:
An announcement is going to be made eventually.
Says who? I doubt one will ever be made. Yuna software wants everyone to think patchou is still in charge. It's been 3 months since they took over.
They just want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by 5n4k3 on 01-19-2010 at 03:02 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
An announcement is going to be made eventually.
Says who? I doubt one will ever be made. Yuna software wants everyone to think patchou is still in charge. It's been 3 months since they took over.
They just want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
I'm going off an assumption that I think is right, just like you.
~ 5n4k3
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by Chrissy on 01-19-2010 at 05:58 PM
quote:'(..)..going on.(..)', i can't see how anything is going on? He sold the company 3 months ago and since nothing except the owner, obv, has changed.
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Originally posted by 5n4k3
quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
Irrelevant. if people will find it eventually after being directed there after reading half a thread, that shouldn't be the way people find out[and certainly wouldn't be the way I'd want my 'customers' to find out about changes to my product]. There is no argument whatsoever against having an announcement on the forum ¬¬
The link is on the first page... and there will be (should be) an announcement on the forums eventually. But if you want to be kept up to speed you can find out what's happening if you look around.
~ 5n4k3
But what if i have totally no idea about the change? Why would i just randomly go to patchous blog? I didn't even know patchou had a blog until this thread made.
People arn't just going to start randomly searching
I never said you randomly go to Patchou's Blog, I said you would find this thread which would lead you there.
~ 5n4k3
But that's the whole point. People shouldn't have to go through a paper trail to find out whats going on.
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-19-2010 at 09:16 PM
[RANT]quote:
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Says who? I doubt one will ever be made. Yuna software wants everyone to think patchou is still in charge. It's been 3 months since they took over.
An announcement is going to be made eventually.
They just want everyone to think patchou is still in charge.
You are so unbelievable ignorant there are no words for it.
We realy should make a list of all your post and shoutbox comments regarding this topic and publish them so everybody can see how big of a fool you actually are when they will be proven wrong one by one.... (not to mention that some of them are already proven wrong).
But hey, don't give up, keep on digging your own grave by all means...
[/RANT]
-------
quote:Until just before the transfer, all the signatures and other related data were still signed by 'Patchou' (eventhough Yuna Software already existed; you can read about why he kept using 'Patchou' and why it did eventually change to 'Yuna' in his blog)...
Originally posted by vaccination
quote:We shouldn't have to go 'clue hunting' to find out the owner of Plus! has changed
Originally posted by CookieRevised
2) There are MANY public signs of the sale, both on the forums, websites, and in Plus! itself
Not to mention that simply changing the footer tags to Yuna instead of Patchou doesn't indicate a sale in anyway, it is [was] his company so it'd make sense to put it at the footer.
But the quote you replied on was more of a response to Discrate's conspiracy theory that Yuna wants to keep things secret and hide behind the name 'Patchou'. Which is completely false, because otherwise those 'clues' wouldn't be there to begin with.
About that 'clue hunting': You shouldn't indeed. I also said and acknowledged before that those are small things and that not everybody would have noticed it. But that does not mean they are not there though.
quote:Believe it or not and like it or not (note: I don't like it either; who would?) but those contractual obligations are exactly one of the main reasons why he hasn't posted yet on the forums.
Originally posted by vaccination
I thought the community was supposed to be a large aspect of Plus!? Saying he posted it on his blog has no bearing at all, all other information in the past, including things like newest updates, competitions and other stuff related to Plus!'s development etc. has all been posted on the forum. Why? Because this is where the majority of the community here gets their information, it is not unreasonable then to expect a post explaining the issues and what is going on. [Don't bring up contractual obligations, there is absolutely no reason what so ever he could not announce the change to us and let such a 'loyal' community know what's happening to a piece of software and its creator they have come to know/love]
Just be patient, more info will eventually come...
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 09:28 PM
quote:don't try drag me into discrate arguement......
Originally posted by CookieRevised
But the quote you replied on was more a response to Toddy's and Discrate's conspiracy theory that Yuna wants to keep things secret and hide behind the name 'Patchou'. Which is completely false, because otherwise those 'clues' wouldn't be there to begin with.
quote:and people are meant to think that this is a good move for plus, selling to someone who won't let the old owner post on the forum.....
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Believe it or not and like it or not (note: I don't like it either) but those contractual obligations are exactly one of the main reasons why he hasn't posted yet on the forums.
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-19-2010 at 10:06 PM
quote:Sorry, but posts like
Originally posted by toddy
quote:don't try drag me into discrate arguement......
Originally posted by CookieRevised
But the quote you replied on was more a response to Toddy's and Discrate's conspiracy theory that Yuna wants to keep things secret and hide behind the name 'Patchou'. Which is completely false, because otherwise those 'clues' wouldn't be there to begin with.
http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=93...d=985361#pid985361
http://shoutbox.menthix.net/showthread.php?tid=93...d=985376#pid985376
(just to link two out of more)
show a bit of another story imho. Especially if you look at the context and the time they were posted (which was in the heat of that conspiracy discussion).
If you realy don't believe in this conspiracy theory to keep things secret than I misunderstood you and I would gladly apologize and remove your name from that post.
quote:It's either that or no Plus! at all...
Originally posted by toddy
quote:and people are meant to think that this is a good move for plus, selling to someone who won't let the old owner post on the forum.....
Originally posted by CookieRevised
Believe it or not and like it or not (note: I don't like it either) but those contractual obligations are exactly one of the main reasons why he hasn't posted yet on the forums.
Patchou hasn't taken that decision over one night either. And he has very obviously studied the pros and cons quite extensivly.
It seems cruel (heck, it always is cruel), but that is how most of such business transactions go. You are always very tighlty bound to NDAs, it's standard issue in the business world...
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by toddy on 01-19-2010 at 10:39 PM
neither of them (or any if my other) say that the new owners are trying to keep patchou the face of the company. all my posts just point towards a dodgy situation, of having owners who don't seem to want to do the public work (work in person, would possible be better wording) that helped plus get to where it is. thus leadind my thoughts into thinking that who ever has bought the company hasn't done it for the good of plus. they've done it to make money.
quote:your only bound if the partys
Originally posted by CookieRevised
You are always very tighlty bound to NDAs
a) want to keep details secret
b) they both agree to the terms
so back to my point of people defending patchou, despite them having little details of the terms of whats gone on. The only thing that is certain, is that patchou has agreed not to speak or is choosing not too.........
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by riahc4 on 01-19-2010 at 11:44 PM
Holy fucking shit.
Did not know this thread got like this. One day posted, the other it is 14 pages long.
Alot of bullshit is being spread around here.
Odd that Patchou hasnt commented in this thread.
Hmm, tried something and by accident resetted the poll. Hey, at least after all the information given here by members, maybe people will rethink and vote "No".
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-20-2010 at 08:02 AM
quote:
And various other quotes of him on these forums and the shoutbox... just to show how right he is...
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:
Says who? I doubt one will ever be made.
An announcement is going to be made eventually.
...
If this all was not a cover up there would be an official announcement plain and simple.
...
I gunrantee they will not post an announcement.
...
They won't change anything, they just want to preserve how plus currently is and just get all the profits.
Messenger Plus! and me
http://www.patchou.com/projects/msgplus/
RE: RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by riahc4 on 01-22-2010 at 04:09 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CookieRevised
quote:And various other quotes of him on these forums and the shoutbox... just to show how right he is...
Originally posted by Discrate
quote:Says who? I doubt one will ever be made.
An announcement is going to be made eventually.
...
If this all was not a cover up there would be an official announcement plain and simple.
...
I gunrantee they will not post an announcement.
...
They won't change anything, they just want to preserve how plus currently is and just get all the profits.
Messenger Plus! and me
http://www.patchou.com/projects/msgplus/
He problably ment a frontpage announcement/news. The last frontpage accouncement/news was on Oct 21 of "Messenger Plus! Live 4.83"
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by CookieRevised on 01-22-2010 at 08:42 PM
[OFF TOPIC]
Sure, that's very easily said afterwards. In that way there is always something to turn around and explain _afterwards_ (which he is also a champion in for that matter). If the thread and his comments in the shoutbox are read closer you can see that he clearly meant any official post, as long as it was official and which common users would easily see too. You can't get much more official than that thread created by Patchou (which is also half-sticked). Fact remains that he is/was plain wrong, with many things, incl. this argument. But enough 'bout that...
[/OFF TOPIC]
RE: Did, in your honest opinion, Patchou sell out? by YottabyteWizard on 01-25-2010 at 08:50 AM
Well this is quite interesting actually I went through the 10 pages of the thread and it's quite funny... after a long time of abscence from the forums think it's time to post a little bit.
I do agree with Cookie and all the fuss is being made about the change, and the people defending/attacking Patchou, even if the software now is being handled by Yuna Software instead of Patchou, that doesn't mean Patchou is out of the game. What I care is at least Patchou still is in the development area of the software even if the guys in charge are others, a bad thing would be Patchou's left complete control and coding to another company which:
1) Wasn't created by him
2) Other guys that rewritted part or the whole code of the software.
Even if I fear the software could be mislead, it was Patchou's desicion and I respect it.
Now to answer the question I don't think he sold out.
Hi SonicSam, long time no see