Shoutbox

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Originally posted by Chrono

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Originally posted by foaly
And that is a good thing... because else it would get more expensive...

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how so? It would be cheaper in my opinion, even if they payed huge taxes

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no the huge taxes would make it more expensive...

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Originally posted by linx05
Segosa, this is a thread about legalising illegal drugs. Is it not? Next time read properly

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he read properly... he was replying to Chrono's post...

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Originally posted by foaly

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Originally posted by Chrono

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Originally posted by foaly
And that is a good thing... because else it would get more expensive...

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how so? It would be cheaper in my opinion, even if they payed huge taxes

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no the huge taxes would make it more expensive...

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It could go both ways... Cheaper because it would be less of a hassle to sell it to people... cheaper becausesupply would go up (being legal and all)... but more expensive because demand would also probably go up... and more expensive because of government taxes and such.

We've had large discussions about this before, so i'll just copy and paste what I said in those threads here...

I think it is a tricky subject.

If drugs are going to be legalised only certain drugs should be completely legalised, there is roughly about £1-4billion to be made from taxation on drugs. And if drugs were legalised lisenced producers could make drugs that you know are as safe as possible. (i.e. they would be X% of the drug, and Y% of another substance that isnt harmful). It would also mean that crime rates would go down significantly, as the profit margins wouldnt be in the current region of 2000%, but more like 200%.

However, there would be very high costs in setting up a watchdog organisation that would make sure there is some sort of quality control from drug vendors. But companies that currently make drugs for treating illnesses would divert R&D $s to developing modified versions of recreational drugs which give higher kicks and dont get people addicted. This could mean a massive decrease in medical breakthroughs. Unless the government gave genorous tax breaks to reacreational drug companies who developed medical drugs as well, but then the money created from taxation of drugs is quickly starting to dissapear to fund its creation.

Also, i would like to see drug dependance centres for people who are completely addicted to drugs like Heroine, they can get free access to heroin that is known to be safe, which must be used within the centre to stop this heroin from being circulated into the illegal drugs trade. This way, people will stop commiting crimes to get heroin, and if there are any problems arising from Heroine ODs etc... they can recieve immediate attention. They have to prove they are addicted to heroine before they can use the dependance centres, and they must agree to take part in some form of rehabilitation, so slowly they can get off the drug, and minimise the risks.

At the moment the organised criminals are operating at around 2000% profit margins. And the multi billion pound market is in the control of the criminals. By legalising it, governments can take contorl of the market, i.e. regulate it, instill quality control checks, and most importantly, tax it. Any deaths that do arise from legal cannabis use will mean the government is under more pressure to do more research into drug use, and also there will be better health care because of increased revenue from taxation.

Also, the argument that illegal drug trafficing will still exist even in with drugs legalised is a load of rubbish. Sure, you cant get rid of the market completletly, but most people are more likely to buy some cannabis from a lisenced pharmacist, than the dodgy bloke outside it, even if it means they can save themselves a couple of quid.

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Originally posted by saralk
Also, i would like to see drug dependance centres for people who are completely addicted to drugs like Heroine, they can get free access to heroin that is known to be safe, which must be used within the centre to stop this heroin from being circulated into the illegal drugs trade. This way, people will stop commiting crimes to get heroin, and if there are any problems arising from Heroine ODs etc... they can recieve immediate attention. They have to prove they are addicted to heroine before they can use the dependance centres, and they must agree to take part in some form of rehabilitation, so slowly they can get off the drug, and minimise the risks.

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That's the only part I don't agree with.

And about the last bit about illegal drug trafiking... To be honest, you can never completely get rid of it... you'd just reallyhave to bare down on how much (if any) enters and leaves the country.

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Originally posted by UTI
And about the last bit about illegal drug trafiking... To be honest, you can never completely get rid of it... you'd just reallyhave to bare down on how much (if any) enters and leaves the country.

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Thats what I said, but there aren't any turf wars between gangs selling ciggarettes are there?

The fact is, that by turning drugs into a commodity, you would get rid of a lot of problems.

Lets take a look at what might happen if we legalised drugs:

Large tobacco companies who are facing reduced revenue in the face of anti nicotine legislation companies, who have a lot of money start selling drugs.

They already have big distribution networks, processing plants and expertise. They can create economies of scale (cost benefits associated with producing on a large scale), lowering the cost of the drugs. Driving prices down.

More companies start jumping on the band wagon -> increased competition -> lower prices as companies compete

The government, with backing and funding from these new drug companies, cracks down on unlicensed entities selling drugs: i.e. the last of the drug dealers.

Prices are falling dramatically, customers no longer have imperfect information (that is they can easily compare prices of drugs, and they know what is inside drugs).

This means that drug dealers (who already make very little money) now make even less money and there is a larger risk of them being arrested.

So illegal drug dealing becomes very unatractive.

We will never completely get rid of illegal drug dealing, however I think it'll be mainly limited to places where there is a chance for a local monopoly, such as the same situations where people charge £12 for a cigarette (i made a hefty profit last time I went to Reading Music Festival ).
And even this would probably be legal drugs bought at a shop, resold for a ridiculous markup.

if drugs are illegal becauses they're dangerous, then why oh why are cigarettes and alcohol legal?because the governments make tax and money off of them, so why not with soft drugs? and its your own fault  for being addicted/or trying them and getting hurt. in england, there's tonnes of help for drugs of any kind, talk to frank, the NHS, samaritans, loads. its your own fault not the governments if you get addicted to cigarettes.

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Originally posted by UTI

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Originally posted by linx05
Segosa, this is a thread about legalising illegal drugs. Is it not? Next time read properly

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he read properly... he was replying to Chrono's post...

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I'll say it again. This is a thread about whether or not drugs should be legalised.

Plus he asked for it on #banana

Related thread:

should cannabis legalised?

You may want to read that for more views/opinions aswell.

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Originally posted by foaly
no the huge taxes would make it more expensive...

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Not really, the fact that they are illegal makes it hard to distribute, hence high prices. If they legalize it, there would be places where you could easily get it, demand would increase (most likely) and so the price would be lower, mostly cause of the fact that there will be competitive stores or whatever selling it.

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Originally posted by UTI
more expensive because demand would also probably go up

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More demand = lower price in this case

It would probably go like saralk said, at least for the economics side of the whole issue

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Originally posted by Chrono

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Originally posted by foaly
no the huge taxes would make it more expensive...

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Not really, the fact that they are illegal makes it hard to distribute, hence high prices. If they legalize it, there would be places where you could easily get it, demand would increase (most likely) and so the price would be lower, mostly cause of the fact that there will be competitive stores or whatever selling it.

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Yeah well in the Netherlands you can just buy it in a "coffeeshop" and there are several coffeeshops in big city's so the effects you are talking about should already have taken effect...