Shoutbox

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
coherent means the individual parts need to have some kind of a relation to the whole. It is enough...

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did you not read my post? as i said before... the telesales person (creator) still explains things coherently and believes it to be coherent him/herself. so do you believe that this is music?

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
That's indeed exactly what my definition says, see the words "for the creator or beholder". If it wasn't something subjective that line wouldn't be there.

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where did you say beholder before? and sure having a beholder would make it subjective..... (beholders tend to have opinions)

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
Music doesn't need to be alive at all. I can create something and call it music. For me it is music and since music is subjective, this is were it ends without discussion...

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well that's your view i guess and we'll just have to agree to disagree

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
indeed. But now you're using the word "music" as something else, as a methafor and not literally; The bell may sound like "crazy" also, is the bell therefore crazy?

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you used a poor exaple there... my one was "..is music to someone's ears" which decribes something pleasureable to hear. yes that is a metaphor, but surely the metaphor is a definition of music in itself.... think about it.

your one was "LIKE crazy" use of the word "like" implies similarity as opposed to definition

It's incredibly hard to define music. What is music to one person is just nothing to another. For instance, in our music lessons at school we are using vocal sounds (like simply coughing, or clicking our tongues), to create what the teacher calls "music". To him, it is music, to me, it is just making noise.

I have to agree with gif on all he has said, especially about the telesales person being coherent.

Google defines it as "organized sound"

music is sounds that go together....well thats what i think

a controlled type of noise? i.e when you bang on the desk you control the beat etc

Music throws out emotions, in a rythm, balanced or not, decided by it's author.

The human being associates music to certain feelings and situations, as ,myself, per example, associate colors to pain, when you have a wound..

My 10 secs of attetion...

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Originally posted by traxor

Personally, I think music is everything...

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Music is everything. Just think about life without music. That... that would be so boring!

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Originally posted by Johny

The human being associates music to certain feelings and situations ...

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Yep. Fast-paced music usually makes you feel happy (or irritated -- I've felt both ), while slow music can make you feel sad.

quote:

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Originally posted by gif83
did you not read my post?

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I did

quote:

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Originally posted by gif83
as i said before... the telesales person (creator) still explains things coherently and believes it to be coherent him/herself. so do you believe that this is music?

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reread what I said... let me say it in a different way:
1) for him it may be coherent, while it is garbage en simply mumbling to me.
2) No it is not music for me as this hasn't anything to do with what I call "sounds".
3) Yes it could be music for me if I was his boss...

The definition I gave is perfectly valid...

quote:

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Originally posted by gif83
where did you say beholder before? and sure having a beholder would make it subjective..... (beholders tend to have opinions)

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As I said in my previous post: I edited the post right after I wrote it, before I read your reply... And creators have opinions of their own too. even by adding "creator" alone, it makes it subjective already...

quote:

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Originally posted by gif83

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
Music doesn't need to be alive at all. I can create something and call it music. For me it is music and since music is subjective, this is were it ends without discussion...

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well that's your view i guess and we'll just have to agree to disagree

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You misunderstood me, It's not the end of this thread aka: of our discussion we're doing atm, of course. It is the end of the "is my own created music, music"-discussion for the creator of the "music". Because as far as he/she is concearned, it is music for him/her and since music is subjective and subjective things are things which can be discussed endlessly without getting anywhere and in the end both parties are correct....

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Originally posted by mwe99
Google defines it as "organized sound"

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my point exactly... organized = coherent (although I added the subjective part to it also). Without it you don't have music. All the other things are irrelevant...

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Originally posted by Tasha
what the teacher calls "music". To him, it is music, to me, it is just making noise.

I have to agree with gif on all he has said, especially about the telesales person being coherent.

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ermm... he said that to proof me wrong when in fact he just prooved that being coherent means nothing more then being organized, or in other words, that the individual parts having some relationship (eg: the earth sounds of your teacher's music; or whatever you may call it). Thus exactly what I said in the first place. You may not find it coherent while it is very coherent for the other person.....

quote:

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Originally posted by gif83

quote:

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Originally posted by CookieRevised
indeed. But now you're using the word "music" as something else, as a methafor and not literally; The bell may sound like "crazy" also, is the bell therefore crazy?

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you used a poor exaple there... my one was "..is music to someone's ears" which decribes something pleasureable to hear. yes that is a metaphor, but surely the metaphor is a definition of music in itself.... think about it.

your one was "LIKE crazy" use of the word "like" implies similarity as opposed to definition

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it is exactly the same.... "like xxx" or "may be xxx" is the same in this context. And thus the example I gave was exactly intended to be like that so it shows that your example _is_ a (very obvious) metaphor and shouldn't be confused with a literal definition. Let me give another one:
"the schoolbel may be music to people's ears" =>
"the schoolbel may be painfull to people's ears".
This is by no means a definition of painfull, although it can be used as an example of what it is... And if your sentence was a definition in itself, then it's wrong, cause music isn't always pleasurable...

Having a degree in music, one could assume I would have an idea of what defines music (I do, thankfully)
However, when it comes to determining what and what isn't music, I would agree with gif83 - music is like art (in reality, it IS art). But more on this later, perhaps.

and now:

THE FUNDAMENTALS OF MUSIC. Part 1

Anything considered music possesses these four qualities:
a) pitch/frequency
b) duration/rhythm
c) timbre/tone/sound colour
d) amplitude/volume

In a nutshell, this includes any sound we hear, since all sound possesses these qualities.
However..!
We can also include sounds we don't hear, as the fact that we cannot hear it is irrelevant. (So I'm not being PC - who cares? Don't start arguing about trees in woods)
Technically, sound is caused by vibrations, and since every single thing in this world moves..

Many of my compositions were inspired by John Cage, who has one particularly well-known piece which all of you will have heard, unless you're deaf (but that raises further questions) called 4'33". I reccomend you all listen to it
I've composed pieces of people building card houses, marching on the spot, slamming piano lids. I didn't quite get to setting one on fire and pushing it off a building, but Black Eyed Peas has already got a piano smashing in their clip anyway.
I recieved high marks for everything - ironic, because it's everything I considered music shouldn't be.
Did I call it music? Yes.
Musical? No.

However, go take a look at Duchamp's signed urinal, it's considered to be the most influential modern art work of all time. Is it really art?

In conclusion:
Music is music. (dooooooolce!)

BTW, I've just composed a new piece while writing this. It's called 'typing at the keyboard while picking your nose'. It's copyrighted, so be warned..
If you want to buy the CD, entitled KEYBOARD SOUNDZ (note the trendynezz!) it's only $24.95 from Te Warewhare.
Included tracks:
- typing at the keyboard while scratching your butt
- typing at the keyboard while poking your eye
Bonus track:
- typing at the keyboard while scratching your eye with your butt


Keep an eye out for my upcoming release, CLICKING THE MOUZE..

minimalism started way before hippies traxor