Shoutbox

As stated before in this thread, there is already a script which let people use voiceclips to send custom sounds, see one of the previous posts for the link.

As for letting aMSN accessing the sound database, that wont happen for several reasons. Bandwidth is one of the main reasons...

As for how the current system works: it is far from "just sending some text". The text itself which is sent does not contain any link. It only contains a sound ID. It is the program of Plus! itself which 'talks' to the server database, does some checks (is the sound banned? does the sound need to be downloaded? etc) and then downloads and/or plays the sound. It also already uses a local cache btw. This protocol between Plus! and the database isn't going to be made public.

As for changing the way custom sounds work in Plus!, so they are compatible with aMSN (eg: the msnp2p method talked about) that wont happen any time soon either. Mean reason would be compatibilty with previous Plus! versions and people using Plus! 3, etc... Also, Patchou never used and never will use the msn protocol to do stuff for his addon. At most, it just monitors the protocol for certain messages for a few of its features, it does not tamper with it. One reason being that 3rd party clients aren't suppose to (ab)use the protocol. Patchou has a very good trustworthy relationship with Microsoft and doing such a thing will compromise this for sure.

For every method you choose to distribute sounds there are benefits and drawbacks. The major benefit of heaving a central database is that sounds can be moderated and information about sounds can be updated/fixed. It also ensures that different people have the same sounds and that sounds are categorized properly.

Making something where sounds are directly send from user to user will quickly result in loss of information of the sounds, mangled up sounds and no moderation can be done.

The whole custom sound system in Plus! is based upon those things and as such it is not possible to do it in any other way without breaking every compatibility. In essence, a completely new way should be programmed. And for what? To make it compatible with aMSN? Don't get me wrong though, but if you had to choose between breaking compatibilty with your own addon in favor of an addon from someone else, I think you also wouldn't take that step.

So unfortunatly, it is not possible to make it interoperable with the current Plus! system and the system isn't going to change.

Though what can be done, from aMSN's POV, is as suggested before: making a system where the user can import Plus! sound packs. aMSN can also send the special text strings to Plus! users and Plus! users would be able to hear the sound (if it exists in the DB or if the user has it in its cache). And aMSN can also check the aMSN user's local sound cache (just like the one Plus! has) to search and play the sound sent by a Plus! user. That is the best you can get/do.

So, the only thing which wouldn't be possible for aMSN is to download a new sound from the DB in case the aMSN user recieves a sound string from a Plus! user with an unknown sound ID.

Whilst I think that it would be great for MsgPlus and aMSN to collaborate for mutual benefits now and possibly in the future, unfortunately Cookie makes a very good point about the reason why this can never be done with respect to Sounds...

The best case scenario given the facts is that (as MeEtc posted earlier) Patchou grants aMSN a license to use the database:

quote:

---

Originally posted by MeEtc
and that probably won't be cheap, if he even agrees to that.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Volv
Whilst I think that it would be great for MsgPlus and aMSN to collaborate for mutual benefits

---

I do agree too
(just to make that clear)

quote:

---

Originally posted by Volv
The best case scenario given the facts is that (as MeEtc posted earlier) Patchou grants aMSN a license to use the database

---

aMSN is open source (correct?), that means that anybody can easly rip out the method to access the database and start (ab)using, downloading and uploading their sounds. I don't think Patchou wants to let that happen and I think this is the main reason why it is closed source in Plus! to begin with.

imo

I only want to say that aMSN people are talking about to find a solution, a possible collaboration. But there are others msn clients that want that feature and maybe they decoded Messenger Plus live sound system (search on google...).
I know that compatibility is a big thing... but sometimes it's necessary to break the compatibility.
We maybe can pay to use database, but also all others msn client will pay?

Most msn client have a plugin system so talking with devs can be not really useful. If a user write a plugin to share sounds with msn live plus. what will happen?

There are many solutions. For example as i understood sounds have an unique ID. So maybe a database can be useful to give an unique ID only when a new sound is created and stop. When we want to send a sound we can send at the user a message with ID, then a plugin check if we have that sound in our cache and send an answer that we (don't have OR have) the necessity to download it from the user.

I think that it is a good solution to save money and to get compatibility.

Sorry for my English.
Thanks, bye.

quote:

---

Originally posted by square87
So maybe a database can be useful to give an unique ID only when a new sound is created and stop. When we want to send a sound we can send at the user a message with ID, then a plugin check if we have that sound in our cache and send an answer that we (don't have OR have) the necessity to download it from the user.

---

That's exactly what I described before (and how the sound system works). You can implement that already in aMSN. You only can't download the sound directly from the server database.

No, it's not exactly what you described before and we already know those informations...
My solution change emotisound msn live plus system, yours no. So it's different and not "exactly" what you described before.

Thanks, bye.

Then please explain in great detail what you mean, because what you described here as an example to how it could be done IS exactly how it currently works in Plus! and what you already can program in aMSN without any restrictions (except for the access to the server DB itself).

Hello CookieRevised.

I try to be more explicit and i repeat what i already wrote:

So maybe a database can be useful to give an unique ID only when a new sound is created and stop. When we want to send a sound we can send at the user a message with ID, then a plugin check if we have that sound in our cache and send an answer that we (don't have OR have) the necessity to download it from the user.

Actually if a mlp user doesn't have an emotisound he downloads it from database. But we can use MSNP2P to send the emotisounds. So we will use database only to give an unique number at a new emotisound and stop. We never download/upload sounds from/to database.

Thanks, bye.

quote:

---

Originally posted by CookieRevised
Then please explain in great detail what you mean, because what you described here as an example to how it could be done IS exactly how it currently works in Plus! and what you already can program in aMSN without any restrictions (except for the access to the server DB itself).

---

He wants there to be a second system for sound transfer - Plus users can access the database to upload/download sound when they are sent/received (as they currently do), but on top of that if the other user is using aMSN and the aMSN user does not have the sound (cached or otherwise) then MsgPlus will use the MSNP to send the sound to the aMSN user. Conversely, aMSN users which send sounds will send a sound ID (if the sound exists on the Plus database), otherwise they will send the sound using the MSNP.

Note: I am simply explaining my understanding of square87's suggestion.

The possibly problem I see with this is it is still abusing the MSN Protocol

quote:

---

Originally posted by CookieRevised
One reason being that 3rd party clients aren't suppose to (ab)use the protocol. Patchou has a very good trustworthy relationship with Microsoft and doing such a thing will compromise this for sure.

---

Ah I see, thx Volv....

Anyways, I already explained here that such a thing is not a solution as it most likely will never happen because Patchou isn't going to abuse the protocol for something like this. Moreover, you are going to flood the MSN server without a doubt with something like this. Result: MS will take drastic steps and is for sure not going to tolerate it. And other tools and addons which currently use the protocol (but don't flood it) are going to be punished too...

The same thing for when you implement something for only between aMSN clients. Be be sure that if you are going to implement something like this between aMSN clients only (so that aMSN users can send sounds between them) using the MSN network that MS isn't going to tolerate it either. And that it is again quite possible that MS is going to take steps also and filtering out any protocol message which doesn't come from Messenger itself and/or even cancelling user's connections, etc...


Now, I can't speak in Patchou's name, but I'm 99,999...% certain he would say something very similar.